|
Post by Dane on Jul 2, 2014 21:08:07 GMT -8
Why can't people go upstairs?
|
|
|
Post by Political Incorrectness on Jul 2, 2014 22:04:08 GMT -8
After what seems like forever, the ferries not have graduated licensing requirements now. She is currently using 12 crew members which means she cannot carry more than 749 passengers or something in that realm and the sun deck must be closed to all passengers. She can be licensed for 14 members but the Cathlament and Kittitas were licensed for 12. Rep. Seaquist wasn't too happy about that but Capacci mentioned about the budget the Legislature approved for this year at this evening's Bremerton FAC meeting.
|
|
|
Post by Barnacle on Jul 3, 2014 7:23:21 GMT -8
After what seems like forever, the ferries not have graduated licensing requirements now. She is currently using 12 crew members which means she cannot carry more than 749 passengers or something in that realm and the sun deck must be closed to all passengers. She can be licensed for 14 members but the Cathlament and Kittitas were licensed for 12. Rep. Seaquist wasn't too happy about that but Capacci mentioned about the budget the Legislature approved for this year at this evening's Bremerton FAC meeting. Actually, we've had them for close to two years. They just haven't come into play on the Bremerton run that I'm aware of.
|
|
|
Post by Kahloke on Jul 3, 2014 20:18:27 GMT -8
From George Cappacci's weekly address this week: It sounds like Tokitae will eventually have the top of the ramp fixed, and of course, Samish and the as-of-yet-unnamed 3rd 144 will have the ramp issue corrected before they ever enter service.
|
|
lifc
Voyager
Posts: 471
|
Post by lifc on Jul 7, 2014 22:03:02 GMT -8
Other than hearing the negative comments that were all over the local radio last week, I have heard nothing about how she is doing, Anyone know?
|
|
|
Post by theoanderson23 on Jul 8, 2014 13:33:43 GMT -8
I sailed on Tokitae several times over the weekend. I drove on and walked on. From my experience she is doing great so far! I can't believe how smooth she sails, by far the most comfortable ferry I've ever been on. She didn't rock or shudder once on every crossing, it was hard to believe. I've never been on a ferry so stable. Perhaps, I just got lucky with calm waters? The only thing I have on Tokitae is that there doesn't seem to be proper A/C or ventilation in the passenger cabin. Every time I went above, the cabin seemed warm and stuffy. Does the ship even have an A/C system? The crew had the cabin doors open so I wonder if perhaps the warm air blowing in impeded the A/C? Other than that she seems perfectly fine. I attended a family reunion on Whidbey and everyone who arrived on her boasted about how wonderful she is. I can already tell when Samish hits the San Juans it's going to be awesome! Tokitae in Clinton by Theo Anderson Photography, on Flickr
|
|
|
Post by Barnacle on Jul 8, 2014 17:49:44 GMT -8
Nice picture--I wish our dolphins were a little more photogenic.
|
|
|
Post by Political Incorrectness on Jul 8, 2014 18:27:34 GMT -8
I sailed on Tokitae several times over the weekend. I drove on and walked on. From my experience she is doing great so far! I can't believe how smooth she sails, by far the most comfortable ferry I've ever been on. She didn't rock or shudder once on every crossing, it was hard to believe. I've never been on a ferry so stable. Perhaps, I just got lucky with calm waters? The only thing I have on Tokitae is that there doesn't seem to be proper A/C or ventilation in the passenger cabin. Every time I went above, the cabin seemed warm and stuffy. Does the ship even have an A/C system? The crew had the cabin doors open so I wonder if perhaps the warm air blowing in impeded the A/C? Other than that she seems perfectly fine. I attended a family reunion on Whidbey and everyone who arrived on her boasted about how wonderful she is. I can already tell when Samish hits the San Juans it's going to be awesome! Did you get a chance to test the ramps up to the gallery deck by chance or get a feel for them in terms of steep angle?
|
|
Koastal Karl
Voyager
Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
Posts: 7,747
|
Post by Koastal Karl on Jul 8, 2014 19:43:14 GMT -8
they should just build a bridge across that route. Seems like a waste of a ferry as far as passenger space. Vehicle space maybe a different story but it's only like a 15 min route isent it?? I thought she did it in like 10 mins the other night I saw on the vessel tracker. How many people actually use the passenger spaces on that route??
|
|
|
Post by compdude787 on Jul 8, 2014 21:23:58 GMT -8
they should just build a bridge across that route. Seems like a waste of a ferry as far as passenger space. -facepalm- So by that logic, they should build build a bridge to Denman Island as well. That's an even shorter crossing than the Mukilteo-Clinton route.
|
|
SolDuc
Voyager
West Coast Cyclist
SolDuc and SOBC - Photo by Scott
Posts: 2,055
|
Post by SolDuc on Jul 8, 2014 21:31:27 GMT -8
they should just build a bridge across that route. Seems like a waste of a ferry as far as passenger space. Vehicle space maybe a different story but it's only like a 15 min route isent it?? I thought she did it in like 10 mins the other night I saw on the vessel tracker. How many people actually use the passenger spaces on that route?? Even without the cost and clearance (for the Port of Everett) components of the bridge, NOAA chart 18440 (Puget Sound) indicates the lowest point in the crossing to be at a depth of 101 fathoms, which translates to 600 feet or 185 meters. Add an extra 50+ meters of soft soil and mud under that and that's waaaaaay too deep for anything but a floating bridge. And a floating bridge can't support the rough weather of Possesion Sound in the fall and winter storms.
|
|
|
Post by theoanderson23 on Jul 8, 2014 21:39:19 GMT -8
Did you get a chance to test the ramps up to the gallery deck by chance or get a feel for them in terms of steep angle? No, not yet but I did stay on the car deck for a while and watched them load the cars and the ramps sure are sharp at the top! Several trucks/SUVs came very close to scraping. I have relatives who commute daily on Tokitae with a Chevy Equinox and they have had issues. I will have to keep up with them on it. Anyone have any idea on how the ramps will be fixed?
|
|
|
Post by chokai on Jul 8, 2014 22:42:18 GMT -8
they should just build a bridge across that route. Seems like a waste of a ferry as far as passenger space. Vehicle space maybe a different story but it's only like a 15 min route isent it?? I thought she did it in like 10 mins the other night I saw on the vessel tracker. How many people actually use the passenger spaces on that route?? Even without the cost and clearance (for the Port of Everett) components of the bridge, NOAA chart 18440 (Puget Sound) indicates the lowest point in the crossing to be at a depth of 101 fathoms, which translates to 600 feet or 185 meters. Add an extra 50+ meters of soft soil and mud under that and that's waaaaaay too deep for anything but a floating bridge. And a floating bridge can't support the rough weather of Possesion Sound in the fall and winter storms. Any bridge would need either 220 feet of vertical (ie golden gate level) or some amount of massive horizontal clearance sufficient for a Nimitz class carrier. The hood canal bridge is already 600 Ft and nothing near as big as a carrier goes through that. I suspect the navy would want more as a safety margin.
A floating bridge would require an anchoring system twice the depth of any other floating bridge thus built, the depths involved would greatly complicate diving operations. And yes the fetch is much more than hood canal, probably 2x. But I bet Everett would love a free outer breakwater. :-) There are huge Multimodal enhancements planned for Mukilteo as part of the new terminal. This could significantly boost walk on traffic over the next decade. Its already up quite a bit with the as is situation.
|
|
|
Post by Kahloke on Jul 27, 2014 13:11:46 GMT -8
I rode on Tokitae for the first time Friday afternoon from Mukilteo to Clinton. Traffic was backed all the way up the hill at Mukilteo even with Tokitae on the run. I had an hour's wait when I showed up, which would have been a 90 minute wait if Tokitae hadn't been there, so clearing an extra 20 cars every other sailing is making a difference. If they ever build a 4th OC vessel, I can definitely see a case for assigning it to Mukilteo-Clinton. Anyway, here are some pics from my crossing: Friday, July 25th, 2014Tokitae docking at Mukilteo 'Mein Auto' parked in Tokitae's spacious center tunnel - lots of room for opening car doors Great visibility of the forward car deck and bow from the bridge And, a nice pano-stitch of Tokitae's fairly full car deck. It surprised me a bit that they did not fill it given the backlog of cars on the Mukilteo side, but they were already behind schedule, and I think, did not want to get any later than they already were, so they departed with some open car deck space And, there it is - a nice sharp ramp What's that I see at the top of the ramp? Looks like scrape marks to me. I'm sure this vessel will get retrofitted at a later date to ease that transition. Tokitae at Clinton Departing for the return trip back to Mukilteo
|
|
|
Post by chokai on Jul 28, 2014 21:42:58 GMT -8
I had the pleasure of riding the Tokitae not once not twice but four times in the last 3 days. So here are my impressions and a few notes:
Re: The Schedule Issues Per the multiple deck crew who I talked to it is two fold: 1) The gallery deck ramps have scraping issues both at the bottom and top. While sorting cars is of course annoying another problem is people freaking out when they see the top of it and jamming on the brakes and backing it all up even though they won't hit. Someone has to run up the ramp and move them along. Trailer hitch mounted bike racks are a particular problem as they can't be seen until after the car gets on the boat.
2) The capacity is "to much" and this is the bigger issue in reality. They are actually fitting closer to 25 more cars on her than Cathlamet, not 20. As suspected since the Issaquah 130's were already challenged at 124 it is taking to long to load and they can't hold the schedule. I was told by multiple crew they simply must get the new terminal and get the walk-ons off the car deck.
3 of the 4 trips I took had lines and on each trip she left with room for 15 to 20 more cars (about the same capacity as an Issaquah not surprisingly) to avoid falling behind. The only one that was a full load was this afternoon's trip from Clinton where they were making up time cause there was half a boat or less at Mukilteo. General Impressions She is a damn smooth running boat and is quiet compared to an Issaquah. Other than the obvious biggie there are lots of little things that need tweaking though such as drains and the like all minor.
Her steering hydraulics are very loud, they can clearly be heard when she is running at low RPMs.
People like her from conversations I had and several I overheard. WSF has put up signs explaining why the Sundeck is closed but there aren't near enough of them and confusion reigns.
And Barnacle you and a few others had pondered her hull design a few times and well, fully loaded hauling butt at 16.5 her wake is pretty tiny compared to an Issaquah or Jumbo or JMII. Here are a few pictures. ;-)
Looking aft from about where the bow wave emerges:
Her wake from the after pickle forks:
|
|
|
Post by Barnacle on Jul 29, 2014 16:05:49 GMT -8
And Barnacle you and a few others had pondered her hull design a few times and well, fully loaded hauling butt at 16.5 her wake is pretty tiny compared to an Issaquah or Jumbo or JMII. Here are a few pictures. ;-)
Looking aft from about where the bow wave emerges:
Her wake from the after pickle forks:
I'm very happy to be wrong.
|
|
|
Post by chokai on Jul 29, 2014 18:21:26 GMT -8
I'm very happy to be wrong. I figured it would be small but after the discussion I was still surprised by what I saw. I remember jumping Kittitas' and Cathlamet's wakes a lot as a kid back before things got so uptight regarding security, boaters certifications and the like so in my book a small wake isn't always a good thing. :-P As long as you stayed behind the boat they really didn't care what you did (within reason). The wake the Issaquah's make right after they reverse the props to dock was a jet skiers paradise, I never got to try that but there were routinely 2 or 3 people waiting for it at the Clinton terminal in the 1980's on a sunny day.
|
|
|
Post by northwesterner on Jul 30, 2014 13:44:11 GMT -8
Wednesday, July 30, 2014 02:33 PM
Muk/Clin: Tokitae out of service, 7/30 Due to necessary repairs, the Tokitae is temporarily out of service. This will cancel the 2:00 p.m. departure from Clinton and the 2:30 p.m. departure from Mukilteo. Updates will be provided when information is made available. We apologize for the inconvenience.
|
|
|
Post by maximase86 on Jul 30, 2014 16:10:07 GMT -8
When it rain, it pours. At least this was quick though.
S
|
|
|
Post by Cascadian Transport on Jul 31, 2014 11:49:25 GMT -8
After a few weeks in layup, my Tokitae walkthrough tour is finally online. It's not a full tour, but it does include all major public areas of the vessel. (Except the Sun Deck)
|
|
|
Post by chokai on Aug 4, 2014 17:17:44 GMT -8
It appears not all was happy with Tokitae's steering and this maybe the reason for the Wednesday cancelled runs. My sis reports that during the crossing on Wednesday she was on they conducted steering tests mid crossing that involved tight turning. This was of course much to the joy of my nephew, a 3 year old ferry fan. ;-) It wasn't clear to me if this was before or after she was pulled out of service.
|
|
|
Post by suburbanite on Aug 15, 2014 17:24:48 GMT -8
WFS lists the top speed for the Tokitae at 17 knots. I have never seen her make that speed on Vessel Watch. Does anyone know what her best speed was on trials?
|
|
|
Post by EGfleet on Aug 16, 2014 7:36:50 GMT -8
WFS lists the top speed for the Tokitae at 17 knots. I have never seen her make that speed on Vessel Watch. Does anyone know what her best speed was on trials? I caught her on one of the other vessel tracking sites when she was on sea trials. She routinely made 17 knots, sometimes better.
|
|
|
Post by chokai on Aug 18, 2014 14:22:42 GMT -8
I clocked her at 17kts on gps multiple times including from onboard her myself. She will record her peak speed in the marine traffic history as 17 to 17.5kts. I don't think vessel tracker updates as often and can miss the peak speed during a given crossing and that's important to remember.
However she rarely goes over the low to mid 16's in service. That maybe a conscious choice to conserve fuel and the like, rather than hold the schedule. Or it could be speed lost over her empty weight during sea trials, who knows how much impact 200+ tons of cars has? I certainly don't.
Regardless that extra knot of going flat out is at most going to gain them a minute or two over the two mile run. It's a big cost in fuel for little gain and I think that's why we don't see it often.
|
|
Ignacio
Oiler (New Member)
Posts: 37
|
Post by Ignacio on Aug 21, 2014 23:53:48 GMT -8
My first post. Let's see if a YouTube video shows up.
I was on the stern having arrived on my motorcycle after boarding started from Clinton. We were about half way across and the engines were suddenly cut. Surprised me as I haven't ever had that happen and knew we weren't that close to Mukilteo yet. Several seconds later the PA system keyed up and I started to wonder if an emergency was happening. Then the voice told us there were Orca whales on the stern.
I ran up and caught this video as we slowly drifted. The whales did their thing for a few minutes and as they cleared the port and eventually stern the voice said, "No extra charge...."
Engines fired back up and we continued on.
Sort of fitting I guess since I understand there was an Orca whale captured on Penn Cove years earlier they named Tokitae.
|
|