"Wheels" on Wa. Ferries

[Scott2]

Can anyone tell me if any of the current WSF ferries still use wheels in the pilothouse? All the pics I have seen show a joystick for rudder control. I think a few of the ferries may still use a telegraph, but I noticed that WSF was recently auctioning off some of these controls on e-bay. I didn't see telegraphs or wheels in the E-bay pics of the steel electrics when they were up for auction, so even these old boats must have had joystick control for steering and computer control of the propulsion. Just curious.

[Barnacle]

The Klickitat still had telegraphs. She also had a wheel, albeit as a secondary method. Only a few boats in the fleet are still equipped with proper wheels.

[SS Shasta]

Interesting question! Didn't the Rhody have large brass wheels in the pilothouses? Were they removed during her rebuild? Perhaps I am wrong and thinking about MV Olympic.

[FNS]

Oct 13, 2008 15:56:50 GMT -8 SS Shasta said:

Interesting question! Didn't the Rhody have large brass wheels in the pilothouses? Were they removed during her rebuild? Perhaps I am wrong and thinking about MV Olympic.

Both had large metal helms.

I had the privilege of visiting the wheelhouses of the OLY and RHODY on the Mukilteo run in the late 1970s.

WSF has the OLY's wheel oriented wrong in the exhibit aboard the CATHLAMET. The wheel was mounted ahead of its mounting, not behind it as we see on the exhibit.

I think the RHODY lost hers when the system was replaced by levers in her rebuild.

Both ferries required locking pins, which were lowered through a hole near the edge of the bow's rim. Before departure, the captain (who would be in the dock side wheelhouse) would center the rudder and send a buzzer note to the quartermaster in the outbound wheelhouse. The quartermaster would give the cue to the deckhand at the outbound bow to lower the pin. A reply note to the other end would acknowledge to the captain that the pin has been lowered. The captain would test the wheel both directions. Then, after getting the all clear signal from the crew at the dock end, the captain would signal Slow Astern on the telegraph and signal one long and two short buzzes to the quartermaster to set his telegraph to speed at his discretion (by then, the mate would be in that wheelhouse). The quartermaster would then acknowledge to the captain that the outbound wheelhouse has control. The captain would signal Stand By or FWE on his telegraph and leave for the other end.

[Barnacle]

I haven't any idea what the Rhody's original steering implement was. Only... (counting...) five boats left in the fleet with wheels that I can think of--all the Jumbos. Every time I go to dock the Hyak, I find myself reaching for a wheel that isn't there anymore.

[SS Shasta]

Do vessels today have a secondary steering system if the main system fails? I remember when "wheels" were used, there were usually two of them, one providing "power" steering" and a second manually operated back-up system. Remember the large wheels on SS San Mateo and SS Shasta? MV Chetzemoka had a lovely brass back-up wheel. Only exception I can think of was MV Vashon. No power steering on that great lady!

[Northern Exploration]

Almost all ships have the ability to steer manually and control the engines that way as well.

I know Carriers can be steered from a wide variety of locations. Prior to electronics they had portholes at the bow just under the flight deck where someone could keep watch if the tower was hit. Now it is done with walkie talkie and wireless headsets. The tower is often one of the first things hit in a battle so that the radars etc. are knocked out. So you need flexibility and the ability to command the ship from a range of protected sites.

The City Class Frigates in the Canadian Navy can be "steered" from a wide variety of locations over the ships intranet. You need a look out posted and you can see all the charts and radars (if functioning) from a range of locations including the command and control room where all the weapons can also be controlled. There are also a wide variety of video cameras with zoom and high definition capabilities that can be used to see.

With electronics going wireless there are remote packs that are either handheld or can be held by strap where most functions can be called up remotely. They often duplicate the joy sticks on the bridge and someone can direct the vessel from where ever they want to stand, the bow, the stern or on the wings.

*think a life size giant radio controlled toy

[Barnacle]

Oct 19, 2008 10:50:38 GMT -8 SS Shasta said:

Do vessels today have a secondary steering system if the main system fails? I remember when "wheels" were used, there were usually two of them, one providing "power" steering" and a second manually operated back-up system. Remember the large wheels on SS San Mateo and SS Shasta? MV Chetzemoka had a lovely brass back-up wheel. Only exception I can think of was MV Vashon. No power steering on that great lady!

Things have moved forward from the 1920s and 1930s. There are back-up methods of steering on all the boats, but none of them are outright manual.

Oh, and I'm going to have to change my answer to "three or four" of the boats still have wheels on the bridge. One ship's steering stand cropped up on eBay, and I recognize it as being from the Spokane or Walla Walla. If they replaced it with another wheel, then... I don't know. I haven't been on the bridge of either vessel since their MLUs.

[Freeland]

One of best pictures that I saw of aux steering was on web page of the
USS Texas steering room. See the gang of wooden steering wheels.

www.taskforce1.org/texashh10.htm

Emory at Freeland

[Barnacle]

Changing my answer again... came across a copy of Sound Crossings (which, as a budget casualty, will shortly be ceasing production if it hasn't already) which shows the freshly refurbished bridge of the Walla Walla with a brand new steering stand, wheel included. Glad to see wheels are hanging on.

[SS Shasta]

Oct 20, 2008 12:58:36 GMT -8 Barnacle said:

Changing my answer again... came across a copy of Sound Crossings (which, as a budget casualty, will shortly be ceasing production if it hasn't already) which shows the freshly refurbished bridge of the Walla Walla with a brand new steering stand, wheel included. Glad to see wheels are hanging on.

Would that be the primary system or a backup system?

[Barnacle]

They're both tied into the primary system.

[Scott2]

I see Washington State Ferries has an electronic steering wheel on E-bay with the auction ending in about an hour. The price right now is about $200. I would love to purchase it for nostalgic reasons if I only knew what boat it came from. My guess is one of the steel-electrics, since we now know they are going to be cut up for scrap. It is on a black stantion, and the brand name is Sperry. The wheel is small. The rudder position indicator is on top in front of the wheel, and the stantion is black. Anyone have any idea what ferry this might be from? Thanks. S

[Barnacle]

It's from the Walla Walla or the Spokane, not sure which. It is NOT from a Steel-Electric.

[Scott2]

I just purchased one of the wheels from WSF. It was listed on e-Bay and sold on 12-1-08. If anyone saw this auction, I would love to know which boat it is from. It is a smaller stand and wheel (Sperry?), and is possibly silver in color, with black handles, and the rudder indicator in front of the wheel. Barnacle, did you ever spin this wheel? I sure hope this one is a steel-electric wheel. The second wheel sold was much larger, this one is similar to the one Oiler described above. Think it came from the Walla Walla or Spokane as well? Scott

[BreannaF]

I believe this is the auction we are talking about......

Washington State Ferry stand (08-3340)JE(7-13-2-1)SS

[Barnacle]

That one is a Super-class helm. The Jumbo stands had a setting on the steering stand marked "Lever-Lever" which sent control to the tiller handles up forward at the docking station; this one does not. The one you have purchased is off the Hyak, Kaleetan, or Yakima. (One of the three actually had incremental markings on the plex for the rudder angle, but alas, I no longer remember which one. I know the Elwha didn't--and moreover, I know where her wheels are. Specifically, still aboard the Elwha. )

I should take a moment to mention that it's very unlikely that you will see wheels from the Steel-Electrics coming up on eBay. The "cool" ones were all removed 20-28 years ago, and only one SE came out of refurb with steering wheels--the Klickitat, which still has them on the bridge.

[SS Shasta]

What actually happens to memorabilia (wheels, nameplates,etc.) from Washington State Ferries? Does it end up on E-Bay, or is some of it preserved for museum archives? Is there any clear policy to address this issue?

[Scott2]

Thanks. I'll do some more digging to see if I can pinpoint which Super it came from. I really appreciate you narrowing this down for me Barnacle. I have always liked the Kaleetan for some reason, maybe it was hers. Now if I could just get a set of telegraphs....

[BreannaF]

Elwha Helm:


eBay Helm:

[EGfleet]

Dec 2, 2008 16:33:53 GMT -8 SS Shasta said:

What actually happens to memorabilia (wheels, nameplates,etc.) from Washington State Ferries? Does it end up on E-Bay, or is some of it preserved for museum archives? Is there any clear policy to address this issue?

Artwork is reused. Some of the wheels have ended up on display elsewhere (on of the Olympic's, for example, is on the Cathlamet; the Elwha's are still on her in the shelter decks and I believe there's one on either the Klahowya or Tillikum).

The name boards of the Steel E's at least are going to museums last I heard. Anything else on board is generally considered as part of the vessel and is sold as is on the boat.

In the 60's and 70's it was largely thrown away. The painting of one of the original Black Ball ships from the Kalakala was rescued from a dumpster by someone who recognized what it was. Name boards disappeared or were thrown out. There simply wasn't much interest in retaining that stuff back then.

I had heard that the state was going to keep a hold of some of that oak trim and paneling from the Klickitat. Whether or not that will actually happen remains to be seen.

[Barnacle]

Dec 2, 2008 18:16:59 GMT -8 Scott2 said:

Now if I could just get a set of telegraphs....

You're welcome. We'd all like to get hold of a telegraph...

[Barnacle]

Dec 2, 2008 18:16:59 GMT -8 Scott2 said:

Thanks. I'll do some more digging to see if I can pinpoint which Super it came from. I really appreciate you narrowing this down for me Barnacle. I have always liked the Kaleetan for some reason, maybe it was hers. Now if I could just get a set of telegraphs....

I looked a little closer, and I can eliminate the Hyak from the options. The shadows where the accessories were give it away. The center rectangle would've been in "landscape format" instead of "portrait fomat" if it were off the Hyak (there are a pair of steering stands on eBay right now and one is indeed off the Hyak). Hang on, I may have a picture of the Yakima's bridge to check...

*shuffling about in office*

Okay, looks like the Yakima's helms had the incremental-degree hash marks, at least in 1998. (I found a photo of the bridge.) I suspect it's off the Kaleetan.

[Scott2]

I'm very curious if the Chetzemoka and her sisters will have wheels, though I suspect with the WSF change of design (one bigger window in the center of the pilothouse) that they will have a control station similar to the other revamped ferries. I see that the Island Home herself actually does have a shiny chrome wheel.