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Post by DENelson83 on Jul 8, 2008 20:54:47 GMT -8
In the wake of the recent Galiano incident, I'm wondering what the different licences are that each ship in the BCF fleet has, as well as the maximum number of passengers allowed and how many crew are required in each licence.
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Post by Scott on Jul 8, 2008 21:19:55 GMT -8
I probably look like a terrorist suspect for doing it, but I often take photos of the paperwork that is hanging up on all the ferries that lists stuff like this so I will list a couple here (it is publicly available information):
COASTAL INSPIRATION:
Class A - 1571 Passengers with 33 Crew Class B - 1177 Passengers with 27 Crew Class C - 881 Passengers with 23 Crew Class D - 0 Passengers with 12 Crew
QUEEN OF ALBERNI
Class A - 1171 Passengers with 29 Crew Class B - 750 Passengers with 22 Crew Class C - 450 Passengers with 21 Crew Class D - 0 Passengers with 12 Crew
QUEEN OF PRINCE RUPERT
Class A - 504 Passengers with 40 Crew Class B - 484 Passengers with 38 Crew Class C - 0 Passengers with 17 Crew
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Post by Hardy on Jul 9, 2008 0:49:12 GMT -8
I probably look like a terrorist suspect for doing it, but I often take photos of the paperwork that is hanging up on all the ferries that lists stuff like this so I will list a couple here (it is publicly available information): Thanks for that John. Much appreciated. Any info on the Spooks or C's??
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Post by kylefossett on Jul 9, 2008 18:42:03 GMT -8
This info is available to anybody onboard the ships. Near the cheif steward's office where the crew keep their timebooks there is a chart that shows each emergency position and who fills it.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jul 9, 2008 19:13:08 GMT -8
This info is available to anybody onboard the ships. Near the cheif steward's office where the crew keep their timebooks there is a chart that shows each emergency position and who fills it. I saw the glass-case with crew timebooks on the Q-Saanich, last month. Is there a reason why the crew timebooks are displayed in the open like that? Or is it just ease-of-access for the crew? It looked kind of strange to me, because you could see all the names of the crew; and I wondered about confidentiality of the workers.... Any insight?
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Post by kylefossett on Jul 9, 2008 19:14:51 GMT -8
Last time I looked these time books did not include full names, just first initial and last name. Fullname of employee is available on their name tag
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jul 9, 2008 19:37:26 GMT -8
Last time I looked these time books did not include full names, just first initial and last name. Fullname of employee is available on their name tag ok, but why do they display the books in the open?
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Post by kerryssi on Jul 11, 2008 11:00:57 GMT -8
The books are not there for the public. Each employee has a service book which lists all the fire and lifeboat drills attended and current certificates. If an inspector shows up unannounced the books must be available and if you forgot yours at home you get sent off. It is a mater of convenience. The casuals carry their books with them but place them in there while on shift so the mate can check them if needed.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jul 11, 2008 11:17:31 GMT -8
The books are not there for the public. Each employee has a service book which lists all the fire and lifeboat drills attended and current certificates. If an inspector shows up unannounced the books must be available and if you forgot yours at home you get sent off. It is a mater of convenience. The casuals carry their books with them but place them in there while on shift so the mate can check them if needed. Thanks Kerry. ...another mystery solved, thanks for that logical explanation. I suppose there's a similar explanation for why various crew members do something with an "Allen key" (or some similar metal object) that was at the front of the forward lounges on the original ships (I've seen that in the Q-Sidney's forward lounge, where various crew members would come by, to the inside front, and do something with a metal object located just under the forward window in the lounge). Kerry: Hopefully this layman's explanation for the Allen-key thing makes sense, and you can explain what really happens. Thanks!
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Post by kerryssi on Jul 12, 2008 8:43:36 GMT -8
That is the watchman patrol which starts up on the bridge then proceeds through the ship to various points right down to below the main car deck. The ones I used were like a large pocket watch. Inside is a paper disc which slowly rotates. You insert the key into the watch and turn it. This punches the disc and you now have proof that you were at that station at that time. It is for insurance purposes. You often see the night watchman in movies doing the same thing through a warehouse.
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Post by Curtis on Jul 12, 2008 9:16:57 GMT -8
I've been wondering why I see crew members do that on the QoB. Thanks for the explanation.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jul 12, 2008 9:43:28 GMT -8
That is the watchman patrol which starts up on the bridge then proceeds through the ship to various points right down to below the main car deck. The ones I used were like a large pocket watch. Inside is a paper disc which slowly rotates. You insert the key into the watch and turn it. This punches the disc and you now have proof that you were at that station at that time. It is for insurance purposes. You often see the night watchman in movies doing the same thing through a warehouse. Thanks again Kerry. I appreciate your experience...
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Post by WettCoast on Jul 12, 2008 11:29:36 GMT -8
I believe that they refer to this as punching the clock and I have always known that it was required for insurance purposes. My brother used to do this when he was a deck hand on the QPR back in the 1960's.
I expect they are still doing this today on the new boats (e.g. Coastals), except that today they may have switched over to some sort of electronic punch clock. Does anyone know for sure?
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Post by Canucks on Jul 12, 2008 22:00:25 GMT -8
I don't know if anyone has mentioned this but for the Coastals deck 5 is to be closed off on a C or D class level. Here is a picture of the official paperwork from the renaissance.
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Post by Scott on Jul 20, 2008 21:28:17 GMT -8
One question I had... can't believe I've never figured this out before, but here it is. Do all the crew members, including the cooks and servers and dishwashers on the ferries (even the engineering crew) have their Transport Canada certifications with MED A1, B1, B2, etc? Or is it only the deckhands and officers?
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Post by ferrytraveller on Jul 22, 2008 15:22:15 GMT -8
does anyone have the passenger license for some of the minor vessels?? And John, yes all crew must have their MED B1, that is survival craft, only deckhands and officers need the A1 and B2 in addition to their B1
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Post by ferrytraveller on Feb 14, 2009 11:31:13 GMT -8
Here is some information on the reduced passenger licences on many of the minor vessels.
New rules mean reduced capacity on BC Ferries Smaller vessels have to cut capacity or increase crew size By Darrell Bellaart, Nanaimo Daily NewsFebruary 14, 2009 Transport Canada has tightened the rules on minimum staffing levels for smaller BC Ferries vessels, raising fears of hefty fare increases and longer lineups.
New federal marine personnel regulations that took effect Jan. 1 mean BC Ferries must cut smaller vessels' passenger capacity or beef up the number of crew members to meet personnel requirements to handle emergencies. For example, under the new rules, the Quinsam, which runs between Nanaimo and Gabriola Island, had to reduce 25 per cent of its capacity.
So far the new regulations haven't had much effect on service in the slower winter season. But Andre Lemieux, Gabriola chairman of BC Ferries' 12-member ferry advisory committee, said BC Ferries told committee members it would add $3 million to annual operation costs. He was afraid even stiffer fare increases will be the result.
"On the 1st of April it's going to go up close to eight per cent already. This $3 million is going to be on top of what we're already scheduled to pay. What it will be I don't know, but it will be on top and it's not acceptable," Lemieux said.
The Bowen Queen, currently on the Gabriola run while the Quinsam undergoes a refit, has had its capacity cut more than 50 per cent to 193 passengers, from 393.
When the Quinsam returns to service its capacity will be reduced by 25 per cent to 293 people, with the vessel's present crew of seven. It could carry 392 passengers, just eight fewer than its old limit, with one additional crew member, but that would mean a greater cost, something BC Ferries isn't willing to bear.
"Normally we would operate with the lower crew, what we call a B licence," said BC Ferries spokeswoman Deborah Marshall. "If we know it's going to be busy, in summertime we would increase it to eight." As an example, she said more crew would be added for a long weekend, or on a run when more traffic is expected.
Thirteen other vessels are also affected: the Mayne Queen, Powell River Queen, Qinitsa, Skeena Queen, North Island Princess, Howe Sound Queen, the Kwuna, Tachek, Nimpkish, Mill Bay, Kuper, Quadra Queen II and Tenaka.
Passenger counts were cut 50 per cent on the Bowen, Mayne, Powell River, Skeena, North Island and Howe Sound vessels. The Kwuna was cut 75 per cent to 36 from 150.
"What it does mean, for BC Ferries anyway, is we have to lower our passenger count on some minor vessels," Marshall said. "Alternatively, we could increase crew counts, but that would increase the cost."
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Post by Low Light Mike on Feb 18, 2009 15:38:11 GMT -8
Here's another news article on same subject, re some of the implementation issues. For the Quadra Island ferry, the article indicates that BC Ferries will be staffing an extra crew-member for the weekday morning & afternoon rush-hour sailings. I was glad to read that, it seems sensible to set staff levels (for that valuable 1 extra person) to the times when it is historically needed. Split-shifts come to ferries..... www.canada.com/bumped+from+ferry/1299983/story.html
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,150
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Post by Neil on Feb 18, 2009 16:40:15 GMT -8
A few months back, Gordon Campbell, (the guy who took all the politics out of BC Ferries) scored some political brownie points by earmarking twenty million dollars of provincial money to reduce ferry fares for a while. He got to look like a guy who was responding to the tough economic times by making it easier for people to get around, although, according to company figures, it did nothing to increase business. That was never the point, though. Gord had to look like he cared.
Now, BC Ferries tells us that for a mere three million dollars, they can add a crew member to most of the minor runs and keep the passenger capacities near where they were before Transport Canada's new regulations kicked in.
Three million, over a year. After non-political-Gord was willing to kick in twenty million for a couple of months, accomplishing nothing.
So why is he not helping out this time? Well, there's not the visibility and news kick that you get out of a one-third fare reduction. And, perhaps more importantly, we're only talking the so-called minor routes; the same ones BC Ferries has been nailing time and again with disproportionately large fare increases.
People can be inconvenienced and financially straitened, but if they live on Quadra or Hornby or Gabriola there's simply not enough of them to get non-political-Gord's attention, and passenger capacities just don't have the political profile to matter.
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Post by ferrytraveller on Feb 18, 2009 17:09:38 GMT -8
well this is a bit of a tricky issue, most of the minor vessels are never full other then the first couple trips in the morning and last few in the evening. Why? Because these runs are mostly commuter routes. So yes some people will be inconvienced because but at the moment no jobs are lost, we are talking about actually adding a body to up the passenger licenses to near pre- new transport canada regulations levels. So what do you do if your strapped for cash and trying to run the company like a business?? Well in my opinion, adding a person during the times of high volumes is a good idea and one that should be done because, they are a transportation company and the main goal is to transport people from point A to point B. I am sure most employees would rather work with existing levels and save a bit of money on that extra body, as long as safety isn't compromised in exchanged for the money to be re invested in new ships for them.
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Post by gordon on Feb 18, 2009 17:18:29 GMT -8
Do these reduced passenger Licenses only affect the minor routes?
Does anyone know what the reason was for the vehicle capacity reduction of 5 0n the Alberni & 24 on the New West?
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,150
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Post by Neil on Feb 18, 2009 17:40:58 GMT -8
well this is a bit of a tricky issue, most of the minor vessels are never full other then the first couple trips in the morning and last few in the evening. Why? Because these runs are mostly commuter routes. So yes some people will be inconvienced because but at the moment no jobs are lost, we are talking about actually adding a body to up the passenger licenses to near pre- new transport canada regulations levels. So what do you do if your strapped for cash and trying to run the company like a business?? Well in my opinion, adding a person during the times of high volumes is a good idea and one that should be done because, they are a transportation company and the main goal is to transport people from point A to point B. I am sure most employees would rather work with existing levels and save a bit of money on that extra body, as long as safety isn't compromised in exchanged for the money to be re invested in new ships for them. I don't really see what makes this 'tricky', especially considering that in their little fare reduction stunt, the Liberals found enough money to satisfy the new TC regulations on capacity for the next six and a half years. You either fund the system to carry the capacity it's designed for, or you don't. There have already been people left behind, and the new regulations just came into effect, and it's the dead of winter. This will be an issue on many runs throughout the warmer months, and not just on commuter runs.
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Post by Northern Exploration on Feb 18, 2009 17:45:06 GMT -8
Transport Canada is under a program where they are gradually bringing Canada's internal standards up to fully international levels. The larger ships already have sufficient "manning" to fit the standards. It comes mostly into play on the older and smaller vessels that had fewer staff. There also is fewer staff who can play dual roles in an emergency situation (catering staff who have evacuation duties would be an example).
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Post by ferrytraveller on Feb 18, 2009 17:47:48 GMT -8
yes i agree. so if you are going to then you fund all the routes 100% and add the deckhands required, especialy for the summer season but the winter months, capacity is probably alright the way it is now.
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Post by WettCoast on Feb 18, 2009 19:40:55 GMT -8
Does anyone know if these Transport Canada mandated changes have affected BC's fresh water fleet?
I would like to point out that it is not just commuter routes hard hit by these changes. Perhaps the most remote route of all, that of the Kwuna in QCI, has been clobbered and the effects are being felt now and will get worse come summer.
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