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Post by ferryrider on Apr 16, 2009 18:14:34 GMT -8
I agree with PK. Won't go far.
The survey asks questions like, does the use of LNG influence your travel choice? Who cares!! what is a factor is reliability, schedule, price, comfort etc. Who do these folks think they are? Ask anyone in business what their customer wants and if they are a success they know. These folks are starting out without a clue what is important to their prospective customer. A solution looking for a problem is what they have.
I will bet that we will see yet another failed fast ferry venture on this thread.
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Neil
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Post by Neil on Apr 16, 2009 18:24:48 GMT -8
But here we go again. My guess this idea wouldn't get as far as Saturna Island before it dies on the water. Saturna Island? I think you're being wildly optimistic, Paul. I don't think this thing will get past the call for investors. This story was on today's Global Vancouver newscast. A figure of $150 million was mentioned, and the on-line survey was supposedly a way of drumming up the interest of investors. I believe Coastal Link Ferries did the same kind of sophisticated market research when they started service to Bowen Island. ("Sure, we'll take your ferry! Great idea!") I wonder if these are the same people we heard about a year or two ago, with their mag-lev boats or whatever they were. The economy is tanking, cross-strait traffic is down, and somebody is looking for $150 million to start a space age ferry service to Victoria. Wonders never cease.
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Post by Dane on Apr 16, 2009 20:48:24 GMT -8
What a poorly written survey! I don't even understand what the last few questions were trying to ask?
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Post by ferryrider on Apr 18, 2009 14:06:41 GMT -8
Watch the story on the net. www.globaltv.com/globaltv/bc/video/index.htmlThe technology is not being used today in Canada (Correct) because the last side wall hovercraft was retired a few years ago in Hong Kong, and the last century in the UK. Hovermarine had the first patent on sidewall hovercraft issued in 1967. Yes 1967 was the first year this technology was used. www.flightglobal.com/AIRSPACE/photos/hovercraftcutaways/images/13924/hovermarine-hm-2-cutaway.jpgThis design is only used in military use now because it is the worst of both worlds. With the side wall it is a boat not amphibious like a hovercraft, and with the hovercraft skirt across the bow the poor sea keeping of a hovercraft exists. For this route sea keeping is a key factor so this design of vessel is not going to work well. Beyond the wrong technology, there is the mismatch in vessel to passenger demand. 500 passengers is twice what Harbour Lynx and Royal Sea Link had, and they could not fill their boats. Also I would say anyone who has $150,000,000 would have a better web site. On so many levels this is another dud. What does Landlocked have to say, he has also lived this before.
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Post by landlocked on Apr 18, 2009 16:13:28 GMT -8
A number of years ago there was a proposal to bring an air supported catamaran to Vancouver Island for use by MacBlo. It used a pair of fairly low power Detroit Diesels (149) series and probably could have been a good fit for Alberni Canal. I have seen aerial film of it going past a 40 Mtr Fjellstrand in heavy weather like the Fjellstrand was standing still, and of course making most of her complement seasick. Transport Canada couldn't wrap their heads around the fact that they were fibreglass, and would not at the time approve a boat of that passenger capacity built of fibreglass.
Now, as far as Nautisol is concerned, you have to consider that on the Victoria run you have two markets - the low end and the high end. The high end is only a small percentage of the travellers, but he's contemplating a daily capacity of somewhere in the order of 4000 pax. I would suggest he's looking at not only capturing the entire current market, at about twice the travel time, and growing it by 100% of it's current capacity. Don't think it's possible.
BC Ferries have some pretty good equipment on the run now, after investing some 7-800 million on it. It's going to be a tough nut to crack. And if he thinks that he's not competition to the big boys, he better think again. They will consider him to be and will use as many of their resources and our money to squash him like a bug. If anyone's considering a ferry run to Victoria, they'd be better buying the fast cats, if they're still worth anything other than scrap and revamping them for props and just get going. Better chance of success than this project from what I can see.
Look, when I go to the store, I can't for the life of me understand why I pay $3.29 for a quart of coffee cream when I can buy it at Wal-Mart or Costco for $1.79. What an entrepeneur needs to do is go after the BIG MARKET, ie the auto/pax run with the Cats at a cheaper price or at the equivelent with more frills. That's how he will be successful. Same product, better price. Hmmmm....starting to sound like the WestJet model to me.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Apr 21, 2009 6:03:47 GMT -8
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Post by Northern Exploration on Apr 21, 2009 7:27:14 GMT -8
In would assume they are doing other research. Web surveys can be very inaccurate. Mind you they may just be using it to get as many responses as possible as a tool to obtain funding/financing. Or just survey as a marketing tool and results are irrelevant. Downtown to downtown service will compete with float planes and helicopter service. Sometimes they will be able to sail when the helicopters and floaties are grounded (fog) but in extreme enough weather they will be affected too. They won't get the airport to airport connecting traffic, or people for the south side of the city. Probably would have minimal impact on BC Ferries given their target audience and fares. Could Ihab be behind this or is this someone else? The timelines sound equally overly optimistic to me, if they are just working on funding and surveys at this point. Hmmm. I have a feeling of deja vu. Could a service hater just be around the corner who while making valid points go off on a tangent. Just when you think the forum is quiet lately .
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Neil
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Posts: 7,151
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Post by Neil on Apr 21, 2009 8:46:27 GMT -8
I don't think Ihab Shaker has anything to do with this. After all, he couldn't even find the money to pay Gibsons what they were asking for docking fees, so chances are $150 million is a bit rich for his blood.
What a joke. They're saying that results from this 'survey' are key to obtaining the investment they need to get this off the ground. If you're a well-heeled but cautious investor in these difficult times, are you going to pay any attention to a totally unscientific open poll of random respondents who may or may not have any intention of actually using a service, and where the questions are poorly framed?
This isn't market research, it's kite flying. Their expectation about passenger counts, and their drawing of analogies with Europe show that this is another group of wannabe admirals with little grounding in reality.
(If you choose to take their 'survey', you'll note that you can answer the questions seriously or ridiculously, and your answers are recorded without it being verified that you are a potential passenger, or some little kid in elementary school. Investors beware.)
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Post by Mike C on Apr 21, 2009 14:26:34 GMT -8
Let's do a little price comparing.
$50 - Cost of 1-way trip on Nautisol.
$13.50 - Cost of 1-way trip on BC Ferries' Route 1. Add in the cost of transit to get to your destination on either side, that's about $7 or so more. So your total cost would be about $20.50.
I'd never thought I'd ever say this in my life, but you save a great deal of money for opting for BC Ferries. And in these "tough economic times" (as CNBC puts it), people will opt for the cheaper choice, even if it is crowded.
Good luck Nautisol.... you're gonna need it.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Apr 21, 2009 18:16:01 GMT -8
Kam actually broke this story back in January 2007. Here's the link to a 2-page discussion thread (yes it is the same proposed venture, headed by Mr. Stein). Look for the great post (reply #36) where the Albertan tells-off us BCers. Also look for Kyle's lesson on what "knots" means. A classic thread, which has given you guys lots of deja-vu this week, as you now realize that we've discussed this before.... ;D ferriesbc.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=smallbcferries&action=display&thread=1931
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Mill Bay
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Long Suffering Bosun
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Post by Mill Bay on Apr 21, 2009 18:22:55 GMT -8
Kam actually broke this story back in January 2007. Here's the link to a 2-page discussion thread (yes it is the same proposed venture, headed by Mr. Stein). Look for the great post (reply #36) where the Albertan tells-off us BCers. Also look for Kyle's lesson on what "knots" means. A classic thread, which has given you guys lots of deja-vu this week, as you now realize that we've discussed this before.... ;D ferriesbc.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=smallbcferries&action=display&thread=1931It wasn't much of a tell-0ff, they didn't even reach for the gun rack in the back of their pick-up.
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Neil
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Posts: 7,151
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Post by Neil on Apr 21, 2009 20:56:45 GMT -8
Here's the link to a 2-page discussion thread (yes it is the same proposed venture, headed by Mr. Stein). Look for the great post (reply #36) where the Albertan tells-off us BCers. As for Mr. Stein's Alberta base, maybe a successful oil drilling province can teach and unsuccesful maritime provice a few lessons on how to be technically successful. Christy Buzzi: So you drill some holes in the ground, extract a product that nature has provided you in abundance, and flog it at unconscionable prices to an unfortunate world that's developed a serious addiction to it. Congratulations. You're a "successful oil drilling province". I know, I know, it's pretty egotistical to quote yourself, but I didn't think that Albertan was quite that sharp...
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Koastal Karl
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Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
Posts: 7,747
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Post by Koastal Karl on Apr 22, 2009 10:19:09 GMT -8
I did the survey just for fun. lol!
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Post by ferryrider on Apr 22, 2009 18:03:15 GMT -8
I would wonder how many people taking the survey are telling the truth? There is no way of knowing who is replying, so who is filling in the questions etc. Do they have an interest in the service? Do they want a job? Do they work for Point Hope Shipyards and want to build the ferry? There are so many people who would want false data in the survey, how can it be controled.
It seems to me anyone with $150 million would be smarter than to rely on this type of market reseach so full of potential erorrs.
It was fun taking the survey.
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,151
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Post by Neil on Oct 14, 2009 16:14:10 GMT -8
So... fast forward six months, and checking their website, it looks exactly the same as April. Silly survey is still there.
No results on 'Nautisol' in a Google news search. Has anyone seen any update on these characters?
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Post by lmtengs on Jun 19, 2010 17:55:53 GMT -8
Nautisol... sounds more like a name for a cold-suppressant drug...
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Post by BreannaF on Jun 20, 2010 13:55:16 GMT -8
Actually, more to the point, the website is still the same as it was in April 2009. So there's another failed dream.
Not that we expected this to go anywhere.......
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Post by fargowolf on Jun 20, 2010 14:23:33 GMT -8
Nautisol... sounds more like a name for a cold-suppressant drug... "For relief of all your cold symptoms, it's Nautisol" WARNING: May cause drowsiness. Do not drive or operate heavy machinery while on Nautisol. Not recommended for women who are pregnant, or plan to get pregnant.Sorry. Couldn't resist. ;D
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