M/V LeConte
Chief Steward
~ I believe in Ferries! ~
Posts: 147
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Post by M/V LeConte on Jan 19, 2009 22:16:58 GMT -8
I also remember when the FVF Fairweather came on line, there was an issue about her vehicle capacity. The design called for the fast ferries to carry in the vicinity of 40+ vehicles and as built they carry around 35. What I remember specifically was the system stated that the fast ferries can handle "35 Alaskan-sized vehicles." I do not know how our vehicle sizes differ than the rest of the world, seeing as one of the most popular vehicles up here are Subaru's.
I am personally not a fan of the fast ferries. They are great ships. When conditions are right, especially in the summer, they can get passengers where they are going in great time. Passengers love them... when conditions are right. When conditions are not so great, I have heard horror stories. They will not sail if the wind is in excess of 40kts and the seas are greater than 8-10ft. In the winter here in AK (as I am sure it is in BC) we can have those conditions for a month straight. Like I said, they are great ships, they just don't make sense to me up here. Both ships are now about half way through their 10 year hull life expectancy and are starting to show some wear and tear. There have been numerous engine problems with both ships and both ships are now out of warranty. Also for the money spent the state could have built 2-3 new mainliners and avoided some of the issues we have been facing there. I could go on and on, but I think you understand how I feel.
Back to the main topic. I love your photo of the Taku Cardeck! It shows the diversity we handle (which can help explain our capacities!) To the left in front is an average sized SUV towing a boat on trailer (probably around 38 feet). In the background behind that you see a large white toy hauler (probably being towed and probably in the 40ft length range). Behind the boat you see a big*** motor home (36+ feet). almost front and center there is a dodge pickup towing what looks like a 5th-wheel trailer (can be 30-50 feet all told.) And finally in the two port side outboard lanes it looks like many "standard" (15-20 foot) vehicles. Throw in some 40 foot tractor trailers, kayaks, motorcycles and snow machienes, and you have an average looking load. (Wait, are those snow machines in between the SUV and the boat?) That is why it is hard to say exactly how many vehicles we can carry, and why we can seem "conservative" on our numbers. (So when were you on the Taku? I see you are headed for Prince Rupert, where were you coming from? Did you enjoy your trip?)
In regards to our vessel speeds they fluctuate based mainly on schedule. Our schedules allow for a little "wiggle" room. If you have ever been on a trip to Belling ham, you may have noticed it feels like we are screaming down Grenville Channel, but when you wake up the morning of arrival it feels like we are dragging our heels. Yet we arrived pretty much on time.
We also have limits as to when we can go through certain spots. Narrows, such as Sergus, Seymour and Wrangell, have tide limits and currents that we want to avoid. At a certain level the Columbia will not make it through Wrangell Narrows due to her draft. Likewise we do not want to be caught in Seymour Narrows when the tide is ripping through at 12 knots. So we will adjust our speed to put is there at certain times. Also in certain spots there are speed restrictions. Tongass Narrows (Ketchikan) has a 7 knot speed limit. We will also slow down so as not to throw a wake at a float house, or a barge or buoy tender that is working on something.
Finally currents can boost or hinder our speed as well. I have gone through South Inian Pass (on the way to Pelican) on the LeConte and our speed has topped out around 19 knots. A few months later when going against the flood tide we were crawling at around 11 knots.
I hope I answered at least some of your questions. ~LeC
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M/V LeConte
Chief Steward
~ I believe in Ferries! ~
Posts: 147
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Post by M/V LeConte on Jan 19, 2009 22:32:02 GMT -8
We received a message from one of our higher-ups recently. Here is an excerpt;
NEW ALASKA-CLASS FERRY The AMHS has reached a point where we have a very preliminary design concept for what we are calling our new Alaska-Class Ferry. The AMHS will now move forward with the public meeting process during which we will discuss this project and take public input. As this process continues, the **company name withheld** (naval architects) - along with input from the newly-formed steering committee (which will include shipboard representation) - will work towards a final design which can be bid out to shipyards. It is hoped that the final design process will be achieved by March, 2010. Currently the AMHS has sufficient federal funding to complete the public process and design. Through a team-oriented process, which will be transparent, we feel confident that a very efficient and well-designed class of vessel will be developed.
There is no mention as to what the approximate size or intended use will be. But it is good to see that we are working to somewhat modernize our fleet. If only Mr. Spaulding were still around...
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Nick
Voyager
Chief Engineer - Queen of Richmond
Posts: 2,078
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Post by Nick on Jan 19, 2009 23:15:44 GMT -8
No mention in there about the number of vessels to be built either. They mention that it will be a "class", which I usually take to mean more than one ship. I've heard that AMHS maintains their vessels very well in comparison to BCF and WSF, but still, it seems there are a number of ships in AMHS's fleet that could use replacing in the not-too-distant future. It's good to hear AMHS is working to stay on top of their infrastructure.
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M/V LeConte
Chief Steward
~ I believe in Ferries! ~
Posts: 147
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Post by M/V LeConte on Jan 23, 2009 23:29:16 GMT -8
And now in official press release form: AMHS releases Alaska Class ferry acquisition project details, website(JUNEAU, Alaska) – The Alaska Marine Highway System (AMHS) released its new Alaska Class ferry acquisition project summary and status report today along with a website allowing for public involvement. The project calls for the design and construction of the next generation of ferries to begin replacing aging ships currently in the AMHS fleet. “This is a grand opportunity to present travelers the opportunity to provide comment on ferries that will be environmentally responsible, fuel efficient and versatile,” said Department of Transportation and Public Facilities Commissioner Leo von Scheben. A project team has been organized, and it consists of AMHS officials, Alaska’s Marine Transportation Advisory Board, Elliott Bay Design Group and public involvement specialist Grady and Associates. “Our goal is to design a vessel that addresses the needs of a variety of stakeholders and provides them the opportunity to maximize use of the AMHS,” said Jim Beedle, Deputy Commissioner of Marine Operations. The specifically detailed project summary and status report is available online at www.dot.state.ak.us/amhs/alaska_class/ . “We hope the public will visit the website to provide comments and follow along as we design the next generation of ferries to begin replacement of the AMHS fleet,” Beedle said. The new Alaska Class vessels will be designed to support ongoing improvements in Alaska’s transportation system, serve intermediate length routes within inside waters and improve system versatility with. The project will be rolled out in three phases. Phase One is the Feasibility Study which the team expects to complete by April 30. The Concept/Preliminary Design phase has an estimated completion date of Oct. 31 and Phase Three is the Detail Design portion of the project with a completion date slated for Feb. 28, 2010. “We’re excited at the possibility of acquireing new, single design ferries that will sail Alaska’s inside waters with enhanced reliability,” said Beedle. “A vitally important part of the project will be the public’s involvement in the future of their Alaska Marine Highway System. A public survey will be posted on the website Feb. 16 and regional and key stakeholder meetings are also being scheduled. Those meetings will occur in Ketchikan, Juneau, Sitka and Anchorage. The public input will be accepted until April 30. For more information please contact Roger W. Wetherell at (907) 465-8994, or by email to roger.wetherell@alaska.gov .
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Post by SS Shasta on Jan 24, 2009 13:04:10 GMT -8
I have been a regular passenger on AMHS vessels since 1972. My move to Alaska that year was on MV Malaspina on its run from Seattle to Ketchikan. Now that I am retired, I usually make about 4 round trip voyages between Ketchikan and Bellingham. My 1st choice of vessel is always MV Malaspina.
With this history in mind, I can clearly state that the top three vessels in the AMHS fleet are the three original "Blue Canoes," Malaspina, Matanuska, and Taku. At the bottom of the list I would place MV Columbia, the two new "fast ferries" and likely the MV Kennicott. I omit the smaller vessels in the fleet as they are usually assigned to short runs that are quite different than those of main line vessels. They seem to be a good fit for their assignments.
Most studies of vessel replacements are weak because they focus most attention "on the age of the vessel." They likely place too much focus on "high maintenance costs" whatever that is. One can hope that AMHS will be wise enough to plan for the complete upgrade of those wonderful "Blue Canoes" and the early retirements of MV Columbia and the "Fast Ferries" Fairweather and Chenega. I withhold judgment on MV Kennicott as I have never been on that vessel. I have heard, however, that her stateroom facilities are primitive at best. Many of her cabins apparently do not have showers and some do not have toilet facilities.
I also hear rumors that this replacement plan calls for new vessels to run as "day-boats" rather than as full service vessels with staterooms. Apparently State bureaucrats do not wish to pay for the crews needed to staff full service vessels. Seems like government administrators frequently want to make cuts in this area but are often eager to pad their own wallets and jobs. Their plans can be set in cement before asking for public input.
This long term Alaskan feels that we need to maintain and upgrade the three original "Blue Canoes." We need to thank the AEMS crews that keep them in such fine and spotless shape!
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M/V LeConte
Chief Steward
~ I believe in Ferries! ~
Posts: 147
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Post by M/V LeConte on Feb 8, 2009 11:35:12 GMT -8
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M/V LeConte
Chief Steward
~ I believe in Ferries! ~
Posts: 147
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Post by M/V LeConte on Feb 17, 2009 23:00:52 GMT -8
Just posted on the AMHS website. The Alaska Marine Highway System Analysis. Phase 1: Establishment of System Baseline. Prepared for AMHS by the Alaska University Transportation Center at the University of Alaska Fairbanks. Originally released in September of 2008, and updated February 2009. www.amhsproject.com/wp-content/uploads/docs/AMHS_Systems_Analysis_%20Phase_I_Report.pdfI have read through some of it. It has so far been informative, and looks like an open and fair analysis. It is also 157 pages long! Happy reading! ~LeC
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Quatchi
Voyager
Engineering Officer - CCG
Posts: 930
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Post by Quatchi on Apr 28, 2009 22:50:48 GMT -8
Hi,
Does anyone know of any pdf floor layouts for the Columbia? I might possibly be taking her for a ride this summer and am curious as to her layout.
Cheers,
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Post by Low Light Mike on May 7, 2009 17:30:45 GMT -8
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Post by BreannaF on May 7, 2009 18:35:23 GMT -8
There are a number of factors involved with the Alaska ferry in Bellingham that would not necessarily exist at other locations. For example, the ship spends most of the day there, it is actually renting quite a large terminal building, and so on. Still, $10,000 per landing sure seems quite high for that sort of thing. (Who knows offhand what the corresponding fee is for WSF at Sidney?) Still, it seems that they were willing to pay it. It would be interesting to see what happened during the negotiations that allowed such a large increase to happen. Or, was it just too cheap before?
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Post by SS Shasta on May 7, 2009 19:40:34 GMT -8
It seems logical that the lower fee was part of the package to market the Port of Bellingham; AMHS vessels originally docked at the Port of Seattle at the pier located just south of Colman Dock.
Other factors that might influence docking fees include the port security requirements that did not exist before 9/11. All passengers now pay $5.00 for security services before they board the vessel. This fee is likely turned over to the Port by AMHS.
Last year AMHS reduced Bellingham sailings to one per week during the summer season and I have no idea about how this impacted the fee increase. The Bellingham terminal is very large and modern, but under used. Many of the shops and office spaces are empty and for many years the cafe was closed. It recently opened again. We would have to walk across the tracks to the bus station/railroad depot for food services.
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Post by SS Shasta on May 7, 2009 19:45:35 GMT -8
Hi, Does anyone know of any pdf floor layouts for the Columbia? I might possibly be taking her for a ride this summer and am curious as to her layout. Cheers, AMHS has a pamphlet showing deck layouts that is available aboard the vessel. Perhaps they could post you one if you ask their reservations office in Juneau.
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Post by EGfleet on May 8, 2009 6:50:12 GMT -8
(Who knows offhand what the corresponding fee is for WSF at Sidney?) $1,400.00 every time the Chelan hits the dock, for the record.
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Koastal Karl
Voyager
Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
Posts: 7,747
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Post by Koastal Karl on Jun 15, 2009 8:45:51 GMT -8
Are the Alaska ferries as bad as people say??? Reason I say that is someone we know did a trip up to Skagway on one of the Alaska Ferries and said they were horrible, dirty, the crew were unfriendly, the food was bad, and so on. I think that was a few years though. It's just her opinion though I cant say as I have never been on them before.
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Post by SS Shasta on Jun 15, 2009 12:16:15 GMT -8
Are the Alaska ferries as bad as people say??? Reason I say that is someone we know did a trip up to Skagway on one of the Alaska Ferries and said they were horrible, dirty, the crew were unfriendly, the food was bad, and so on. I think that was a few years though. It's just her opinion though I cant say as I have never been on them before. I would strongly disagree with those comments. I ride the Alaska ferry from Ketchikan to Bellingham two or three times a year. The Blue Canoes are well maintained, clean, and have wonderful folksy crews. Some folks, usually summer tourists, confuse AMHS vessels with cruise ships and expect to find similar services on the ferries. Once in a while a vessel becomes a bit cluttered after hauling 200 or 300 high school students between ports, but crews keep the vessels spotless most of the time. In spite of their age, there are few if any rust spots on any of the vessels. Guess my only complaint is that I do not like the design of MV Columbia and she has been known for many mechanical breakdowns. Guess one could call her the "ELWHA" of the fleet. She also lacks a single outside deck to walk around the ship. All in all, they are "fun ships" for Alaskans.
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Post by WettCoast on Jun 15, 2009 18:44:49 GMT -8
Are the Alaska ferries as bad as people say??? Reason I say that is someone we know did a trip up to Skagway on one of the Alaska Ferries and said they were horrible, dirty, the crew were unfriendly, the food was bad, and so on. I think that was a few years though. It's just her opinion though I cant say as I have never been on them before. Karl, When you say "as bad as people say" do you actually mean as bad as one person said? My experience last summer was very good. The ferries are very well kept, probably better than what we see with BCFS vessels. The crew was generally every bit as friendly as what we see in BC. On the other hand I think that the AMHS's food service does not measure up to what we have on comparable BCFS vessels. In some respects I would say that the AMHS ferry service is superior to what we have in BC. All of the vessels have decent forward lounges that you do not have to pay extra to use. During the summer, naturalists run on board programs talking to travelers about the land/sea scapes that you are passing through. All of the larger boats have solariums where back packers can camp out. BCFS would never allow such as that would cut into their secondary revenue stream. It appears to me that the AMHS is still run as a service to both the citizens of Alaska and for visitors to Alaska. They are not operating a wannabe cruise ship service. I think that BC just might be better served by such an approach. On the other side of the coin the AMHS needs to get rolling on fleet renewal. Much of there fleet is of the same vintage as our V class vessels.
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Koastal Karl
Voyager
Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
Posts: 7,747
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Post by Koastal Karl on Jun 16, 2009 8:20:59 GMT -8
I am just telling you what she told me. I dont know how many years ago it was but that was her opinion and said she would never put down the BC Ferries ever again after going on Alaska Ferries. Maybe they just had a bad experience. I dont know, I cant say cause I have never been on the Alaska Ferries.
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Quatchi
Voyager
Engineering Officer - CCG
Posts: 930
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Post by Quatchi on Jun 16, 2009 10:18:38 GMT -8
Gimme a couple of weeks, I am doing the Skagway to Bellingham run on the Columbia. I will report back and tell you guys what I think about AMHS vs BCF.
Cheers,
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rt1commuter
Chief Steward
JP - Overworked grad student
Posts: 167
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Post by rt1commuter on Jun 16, 2009 20:01:11 GMT -8
I'm planning on a Skagway to Bellingham myself, at the end of August.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jun 24, 2009 17:10:29 GMT -8
M/V Matanuska was in BC waters today, sailing north through Georgia & Johnstone straits. As of around 1700hrs she was off of Port Hardy.
She must have finished her southern repair work, and is headed back to service.
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Koastal Karl
Voyager
Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
Posts: 7,747
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Post by Koastal Karl on Jul 14, 2009 9:48:24 GMT -8
Where is the Alaska Ferry dock in Juneau? When we were in Juneau on our Alaska Cruise I never was able to locate the ferry dock. Where abouts in the town is it??? Been looking at my photos and I still cant find it.
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Post by Kahloke on Jul 14, 2009 10:12:35 GMT -8
It's to the northwest of the airport. See the Google Earth Images: AMHS Terminal Juneau Juneau Airport Area (the blue line represents the ferry route)
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M/V LeConte
Chief Steward
~ I believe in Ferries! ~
Posts: 147
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Post by M/V LeConte on Jul 14, 2009 17:16:11 GMT -8
It's to the northwest of the airport. See the Google Earth Images: AMHS Terminal Juneau That would be the Kennicott at the Main Berth. The Kennicott is usually the only ship to tie-up Port side to in Juneau. The West Berth is to the Left. And the Fast Ferry Berth is in between the Kennicott and the shoreline. It angles out to the right. The fast ferries stern-load in Juneau. This is an older photo. The "indent" in the shoreline under the number 7 has since been filled in and now contains the Fast Ferry Warehouse and Maintenance Facility.
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Koastal Karl
Voyager
Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
Posts: 7,747
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Post by Koastal Karl on Jul 14, 2009 22:12:25 GMT -8
Wow, we dident even see half of Juneau. Looks like there is another area of Juneau. The cruise ships seem to dock at the other end of Juneau nowhere near the airport end.
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rt1commuter
Chief Steward
JP - Overworked grad student
Posts: 167
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Post by rt1commuter on Jul 15, 2009 19:05:34 GMT -8
Ok, heres one on travel advice. At the end of August, I'm planning on traveling on the Columbia from Skagway to Bellingham. I noticed that the stop overs in various ports are pretty long (usually a few hours). Any chance of getting off and looking around during one of these stops?
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