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Post by WettCoast on Jan 17, 2014 12:16:05 GMT -8
BC Ferries fuel surcharges, fare increases & service cutbacks being discussed on CBC Radio Almanac program right now.
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Post by Scott on Jan 17, 2014 16:24:35 GMT -8
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SolDuc
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West Coast Cyclist
SolDuc and SOBC - Photo by Scott
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Post by SolDuc on Jan 17, 2014 16:33:34 GMT -8
Here's another one, which already has almost 10,000 signatures: here
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2014 16:40:09 GMT -8
One problem with the Route-40 situation (where the tourism tax-dollars outweigh the route's net operating loss) is that the only available ship for the route is nearing her expiry-date. So for the Province to continue to enjoy the overall net profit from this route, a considerable investment would need to be made, and made soon. - and that looming large expenditure was probably the override to any argument about the tax-dollars benefit of the route. ...but that expiry wasn't going to happen in 2014, so they could have held onto the route for a few more years. Quite a stark contrast to the Southern Routes, where sailings averaging 70% are not being cut.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Jan 17, 2014 18:55:11 GMT -8
This is a good step in the right way direction for BC Ferries. Would making it public be include under the heading "(d)evelop a long-term plan to fix BC Ferries, and ensure it’s sustainable for residents and businesses on the coast" because that the only way to fix the system? I have signed up on website to support. Has anyone else signed up for the changes for BC Ferries?
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Neil
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Post by Neil on Jan 17, 2014 19:30:34 GMT -8
This is a good step in the right way direction for BC Ferries. Would making it public be include under the heading "(d)evelop a long-term plan to fix BC Ferries, and ensure it’s sustainable for residents and businesses on the coast" because that the only way to fix the system? I have signed up on website to support. Has anyone else signed up for the changes for BC Ferries? Sorry AC, but you're wasting your time. A politically based petition is utterly useless, and will be discounted. If there are any changes to the proposed cutbacks they will not come from efforts like this.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2014 8:46:21 GMT -8
Sorry AC, but you're wasting your time. A politically based petition is utterly useless, and will be discounted. If there are any changes to the proposed cutbacks they will not come from efforts like this. What do you think would make changes to the cutbacks?
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Post by WettCoast on Jan 18, 2014 9:26:20 GMT -8
Sorry AC, but you're wasting your time. A politically based petition is utterly useless, and will be discounted. If there are any changes to the proposed cutbacks they will not come from efforts like this. What do you think would make changes to the cutbacks? The changes have to be made by the Liberal government. They have no use for the opinions of people living in coastal communities, most of whom vote for the dreaded Commies. They might, however, be swayed by businesses in coastal communities. Businesses (especially those in the tourism sector) are taking a wallop, just like the people. If these coastal community based businesses acted together, they could sway the government to increase support to the coastal 'highways' system.
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Post by compdude787 on Jan 18, 2014 10:24:28 GMT -8
This is a good step in the right way direction for BC Ferries. Would making it public be include under the heading "(d)evelop a long-term plan to fix BC Ferries, and ensure it’s sustainable for residents and businesses on the coast" because that the only way to fix the system? I have signed up on website to support. Has anyone else signed up for the changes for BC Ferries? Sorry AC, but you're wasting your time. A politically based petition is utterly useless, and will be discounted. If there are any changes to the proposed cutbacks they will not come from efforts like this. Yeah, you're right. I'm pretty sure that the Liberals would just completely ignore a petition that was started by the opposition party.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Jan 18, 2014 12:44:56 GMT -8
Sorry AC, but you're wasting your time. A politically based petition is utterly useless, and will be discounted. If there are any changes to the proposed cutbacks they will not come from efforts like this. Yeah, you're right. I'm pretty sure that the Liberals would just completely ignore a petition that was started by the opposition party.
When it comes to election time this could change the government because if enough people want change in BC Ferries, if the Liberals do not do it and the NDP will promise change in BC Ferries during the election campaign most people who signed the website would vote for them. So, if the Liberals do not change BC Ferries it could back fire on them during the election; so this could not be useless if the current government thinks in future for the election.
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Post by compdude787 on Jan 18, 2014 13:35:35 GMT -8
Yeah, you're right. I'm pretty sure that the Liberals would just completely ignore a petition that was started by the opposition party.
When it comes to election time this could change the government because if enough people want change in BC Ferries, if the Liberals do not do it and the NDP will promise change in BC Ferries during the election campaign most people who signed the website would vote for them. So, if the Liberals do not change BC Ferries it could back fire on them during the election; so this could not be useless if the current government thinks in future for the election. Remember that the NDP promised to do this in the last election, but they did not get elected. But then again, there were probably many other factors that caused the NDP and Adrian Dix to lose the election. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Dix was just being too nice and soft-spoken rather than pointing out the reasons why people shouldn't vote for the Liberals.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jan 18, 2014 14:20:58 GMT -8
They might, however, be swayed by businesses in coastal communities. Businesses (especially those in the tourism sector) are taking a wallop, just like the people. If these coastal community based businesses acted together, they could sway the government to increase support to the coastal 'highways' system. I believe that the various Chambers of Commerce in coastal communities are starting to speak with a united voice on these issues. These are organizations of businesses who usually "have the ear of the Government."
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Neil
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Posts: 7,196
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Post by Neil on Jan 18, 2014 22:32:09 GMT -8
What do you think would make changes to the cutbacks? The changes have to be made by the Liberal government. They have no use for the opinions of people living in coastal communities, most of whom vote for the dreaded Commies. They might, however, be swayed by businesses in coastal communities. Businesses (especially those in the tourism sector) are taking a wallop, just like the people. If these coastal community based businesses acted together, they could sway the government to increase support to the coastal 'highways' system. Exactly. That's why the study by the tourism association might have some impact; it's not from all those entitled-hippy-latte swilling lawyer types (or whatever other ridiculous stereotype you care to manufacture) who weekend at their Active Pass getaways... it's from business people who the Christy Clark Liberals actually respect. Build a business case against the cuts, and an accounting argument that their minds can understand, and you may have a chance of getting through. It's not about communities, or families- despite the Clark rhetoric. You need to reach them on their own terms.
Still... a long shot.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jan 29, 2014 19:47:16 GMT -8
Here's a proposal from a Powell River resident for having the Sunshine Coast start its own ferry company. Read the proposal and have a good laugh. That author conveniently ignores the costs of building roads, bridges and ferry terminals, and also ignores the geography and land acquisition costs related to new ferry routes and roads. Also, that author doesn't know the difference between Howe Sound and Jervis Inlet. He continually refers to Jervis Inlet as "Howe Sound." So, if I've enticed you into spending a few moments on some comedy reading, here's the link. I can't believe this is someone's real idea
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SolDuc
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West Coast Cyclist
SolDuc and SOBC - Photo by Scott
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Post by SolDuc on Jan 29, 2014 20:54:37 GMT -8
So this guy wants to build low-cost floating bridges to replace ferry routes... I think I've already heard this, very locally. I also believe that that bridge collapsed and the ferry route was brought back as a result while the bridge was being built back.
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Neil
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Posts: 7,196
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Post by Neil on Jan 29, 2014 21:42:43 GMT -8
Here's a proposal from a Powell River resident for having the Sunshine Coast start its own ferry company. Read the proposal and have a good laugh. That author conveniently ignores the costs of building roads, bridges and ferry terminals, and also ignores the geography and land acquisition costs related to new ferry routes and roads. Also, that author doesn't know the difference between Howe Sound and Jervis Inlet. He continually refers to Jervis Inlet as "Howe Sound." So, if I've enticed you into spending a few moments on some comedy reading, here's the link. I can't believe this is someone's real ideaOmigawd. Where did you find this? This clown deserves some withering responses. He doesn't understand geography, communities, basic costs... he can't even get his distances right. And who in his right mind would contemplate a highway across Bowen Island? I've heard some incredibly stupid ferry proposals in my time, but this wins the all time doofus award. Yes, comedy... but bad comedy. Wow.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jan 29, 2014 21:52:16 GMT -8
Omigawd. Where did you find this? This clown deserves some withering responses. He doesn't understand geography, communities, basic costs... he can't even get his distances right. And who in his right mind would contemplate a highway across Bowen Island? I've heard some incredibly stupid ferry proposals in my time, but this wins the all time doofus award. Yes, comedy... but bad comedy. Wow. I found this in an opinion piece in today's Powell River Peak newspaper. Here's the link to the item: HERE
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Post by compdude787 on Jan 29, 2014 22:10:17 GMT -8
Here's a proposal from a Powell River resident for having the Sunshine Coast start its own ferry company. Read the proposal and have a good laugh. That author conveniently ignores the costs of building roads, bridges and ferry terminals, and also ignores the geography and land acquisition costs related to new ferry routes and roads. Also, that author doesn't know the difference between Howe Sound and Jervis Inlet. He continually refers to Jervis Inlet as "Howe Sound." So, if I've enticed you into spending a few moments on some comedy reading, here's the link. I can't believe this is someone's real ideaMan, these are some really ambitious, and expensive, ideas that someone has. First of all, I don't think people on Bowen and Keats Island would be that happy about having a ferry going between their two islands and a bridge to Gibsons. Currently, Keats Islanders live there because of the isolation. They made the decision to move to that island in spite of the fact that you can't drive on and off of it unless you hired a tug/barge or a landing craft. Second of all, the idea of having Route 7 replaced with a floating bridge from near Earls Cove to rugged and mostly-uninhabited Nelson Island, (I'm going to refer to this bridge as the Agamemnon Channel Bridge since it crosses said channel) and a shorter ferry route to Earl's Cove is also an expensive and impractical idea. Nelson Island is pretty rugged, it seems, and it would be quite an engineering feat to build a road thru there. Also I don't think it's possible to build a floating bridge across the Agamemnon Channel because of the high cliffs on either side. Building a bridge near the powerline crossing wouldn't really work because on the Nelson Island side, there's a big mountain there. Whoever came up with this proposal didn't really think it through. They referenced a pontoon bridge in Norway called the Bergsøysund Bridge ( wikipedia article) but there are no cliffs on either side of the channel that it crosses. So, in short, this ain't gonna work unless you spend millions of dollars on new bridges. I think ferries are a lot cheaper than that...
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Neil
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Posts: 7,196
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Post by Neil on Jan 29, 2014 22:49:27 GMT -8
Compdude, I just don't think it's productive to respond to idiots with a reasoned argument. In doing so, you give their nonsense some validity. There are very serious concerns brought about by the recent cutbacks, and fantasies such as the proposal from this guy just sidetrack the important discussion.
As Mr Horn said, this was comedy (at best), nothing more.
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Post by compdude787 on Jan 30, 2014 10:20:14 GMT -8
Compdude, I just don't think it's productive to respond to idiots with a reasoned argument. In doing so, you give their nonsense some validity. There are very serious concerns brought about by the recent cutbacks, and fantasies such as the proposal from this guy just sidetrack the important discussion.
As Mr Horn said, this was comedy (at best), nothing more. No, I actually think that it is productive to respond to those people in that way because it shows how dumb their idea is. When you are arguing against someone's idea, you can't just give a "you're stupid" type of a response without explaining why their idea is stupid. You have to assume they're stupid enough to not know how dumb their idea was. (hmm, sorry if I offended anyone with that previous sentence.) Hey, I thought it was fun to consider whether this would work, and in the process, I learned a bit more about the topography of Nelson Island.
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Post by Curtis on Feb 5, 2014 13:34:42 GMT -8
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Post by Low Light Mike on Feb 5, 2014 14:47:49 GMT -8
Here is today's news release from the Province of BC, which is what caused BCFerries to do their above-noted news release: from HERE========================
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Post by Low Light Mike on Feb 5, 2014 14:48:39 GMT -8
Here is the final report from the consultants on the public consultation process: Lots of links to items H E R E
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Koastal Karl
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Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
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Post by Koastal Karl on Feb 5, 2014 18:13:53 GMT -8
Why does everything say BC Ferries?? Issent it the government that is doing this???
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Post by Low Light Mike on Feb 5, 2014 18:29:58 GMT -8
Why does everything say BC Ferries?? Whhat do you mean ?? I spent 8 minutes listening to Minister Stone's speech, and I read his Ministry's press release. Both of these were from the Province of BC's website. And now I'm reading through the public consultation consultant's report, which reported to the Ministry, not to BC Ferries. Both items from today are linked in this thread.
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