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Post by Coastal Canuck on Jul 7, 2007 23:09:04 GMT -8
When I was camping in a campground in Mill Bay I heard a few people talking that the people on Bowen Island want a larger boat that carries around 115 cars. I personally think they need a bigger boat but not that big.
Please post what you think
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Post by Retrovision on Jul 8, 2007 0:26:01 GMT -8
This has been an issue for years now, and BCFS refuses to give them anything larger than what they have until they upgrade terminal facilities. It seems to me that the new 'I' Class vessel currently under construction and the mention of it possibly going to Bowen Island after Jervis Inlet is intended as enticement for the Islanders to improve the terminal (or build a new one) and agree with all that entails, which they are currently against.
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Post by Fenklebaum on Jul 8, 2007 0:33:12 GMT -8
If the Bourgeois Islanders want more capacity then they should build their own damn boat. I'm sick to death of hearing about folks who have turned a great island into a yuppie suburb whining and bitching about how they can't get their Bentleys aboard a sailing without waiting for more than fifteen minutes.
Fenk, angry
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Post by hergfest on Jul 8, 2007 5:50:45 GMT -8
Or they could just add platforms to the Cappy.
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Koastal Karl
Voyager 
Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
Posts: 7,747
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Post by Koastal Karl on Jul 8, 2007 9:17:27 GMT -8
Or they could just add more sailings and have shorter turn around times!!
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Post by Retrovision on Jul 8, 2007 10:04:25 GMT -8
Or they could just add more sailings and have shorter turn around times!! Would our immaculate new RADs even allow for this?  Not that I think it's a bad idea.  |
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Doug
Voyager
Lurking within...the car deck.
Posts: 2,213
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Post by Doug on Jul 8, 2007 12:22:32 GMT -8
Or they could just add platforms to the Cappy. That's what I was thinking they would do.... |
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Post by Retrovision on Jul 8, 2007 12:59:40 GMT -8
Or they could just add platforms to the Cappy. That's what I was thinking they would do.... One reason that the Route 5, Swartz Bay to Southern Gulf Islands, schedule of the Queen of Cumberland, the sister to the Queen of Capilano with platforms, is able to allow the use of platforms is the slower pace of the route compared to the Bowen Island route. Adding platforms to the ' Capilano, although seemingly a natural progression of the route to meet rising volume demands for a bedroom community of Vancouver (and part of the GVRD), would be time prohibitive for keeping the route on the current schedule, especially with the current TC regulation that requires that no passenger be on the platforms while they're being raised or lowered, to the point of the ballance between the longer turn around time and the added capacity makes it so close to the current capacity of the route that the investment and hastle would relatively soon be outpaced by demand yet again. |
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jul 8, 2007 14:30:59 GMT -8
On the Cumberland, there's a unique sign posted on the wall that explains the reasons why platforms are needed.
It's one of those pros & cons items. The con is the time & hassle needed to raise & lower them. The pro is that people don't get left behind.
I agree that on a short-haul like Bowen/HorseshoeBay, that the time spent raising & lowering wouldn't be worth the benefit.
I wonder what the breaking-point is on this arguement?
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Post by Fenklebaum on Jul 8, 2007 21:50:54 GMT -8
I fail to see how there would be a hassle. Pull a 'Powell River Class' and cut back on the amount of overheight capacity by making the ramps permanently fixed. Leave a single outboard lane on either side for overheight traffic, and voila: gallery decks a la C Class.
Of course, they'd probably cry foul; somehow, this would lower their property values.
Fenk, from the peanut gallery deck
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Mirrlees
Voyager
Bathtub!
Deck Engineer- Queen of Richmond
Posts: 1,013
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Post by Mirrlees on Jul 8, 2007 22:24:32 GMT -8
If gallery decks were added, I think that it would make the Cappie a nightmare to load. That is, if there were a disproportionate number of overheights to cars causing her to sail with a list. Then again, the Nanny sails with a list most of the time too...  |
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Post by Hardy on Jul 9, 2007 5:05:57 GMT -8
Or they could just add platforms to the Cappy. Agreeing with the other posts so far, the time constraints versus the sailing time makes this option moot. Plus, with the cost, they'd be better off just adding sailings/reducing turn-around time to add capacity. I don't think that a bigger boat will necessarily assist too much, as there is limited space on the island for a holding facility (terminal). Do you really want to dump 200 cars onto Bowen in one sailing? Keep the performance on time, don't wait for stragglers and just cut down on the turn around time. |
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Post by Northern Exploration on Jul 9, 2007 5:50:32 GMT -8
*Cough* so Hardy is saying bigger isn't always better. I guess it is the old story of it isn't the size that counts but what you do with it sort of thing applies to ferries.  ;D |
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Post by Why on Jul 12, 2007 11:39:44 GMT -8
If Bowen Island is part of the GVRD then why is ferry service being provided by the Province, and not Translink, given that the roads connecting the two areas aren't considered highways...
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Post by Mike C on Jul 12, 2007 11:44:22 GMT -8
Ask BC Ferries that same question. C'mon, I dare ya |
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Post by keefer on Jul 12, 2007 12:39:37 GMT -8
If Bowen Island is part of the GVRD then why is ferry service being provided by the Province, and not Translink, given that the roads connecting the two areas aren't considered highways... BC Ferries has the terminal at Horseshoe and one side is a highway, is probably the answer you'd get... not saying it's a great answer, but it is one. |
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Post by Hardy on Jul 12, 2007 19:14:28 GMT -8
*Cough* so Hardy is saying bigger isn't always better. I guess it is the old story of it isn't the size that counts but what you do with it sort of thing applies to ferries. ;D Nice! Yes, exactly what I am saying. [tongue-in-cheek] How about for a week they get say, QofEsq, a nice single-ended V-class for their tiny Bowen Run. Let's load the ship full, back it out, turn it around, and sail to Bowen and unload 200 cars at once. Of course, you'll get half the number of round-trips you have now, if you have to load it full each time, and the sailing time will double due to the single-ended nature. Plus, navigating into Snug is a bit tricky ... but what the hell--they want a bigger boat, let'em try it on for size and see how well it works out for them! [/tongue-in-cheek]  |
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Post by Hardy on Jul 12, 2007 19:23:41 GMT -8
If Bowen Island is part of the GVRD then why is ferry service being provided by the Province, and not Translink, given that the roads connecting the two areas aren't considered highways... Hmmm .... ummmm .... well ..... ahhhh ..... one is a private company who gouges "captive markets" and the other one is a government entity that gouges "captive markets". Translink raises fares on public transit using the stick and even-bigger stick approach to increase ridership and ease traffic congestion. Nope, I don't really have a good answer for you. Minister responsible for pork-barrel appointments and back-door-kickbacks should be the right one to ask this question to! ........... |
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,307
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Post by Neil on Jul 12, 2007 19:47:55 GMT -8
Bowen Island is in the GVRD, Gabriola Island is in the Nanaimo Regional District, Texada Island is in the Powell River Regional District, and the Saanich Inlet service is in the Capitol Regional District. So... what's the point that's being made here?
One of the things that strikes me about this forum is that everyone loves the ferry boats, but quite often, those who actually use them regularly, especially those who agitate for better service, are often regarded rather cynically. (I know Hardy's comments were in jest.)
Regarding an earlier comment, not all Bowen Islanders are millionaires driving Bentleys. A lot of them are just working people wanting a dependable connection to get into town.
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Post by kylefossett on Jul 12, 2007 20:00:58 GMT -8
If Bowen Island is part of the GVRD then why is ferry service being provided by the Province, and not Translink, given that the roads connecting the two areas aren't considered highways... saltspring, the penders, saturna, mayne, and galiano are all part of the capital regional district so you can ask why is the ferry service there part of bc ferries and not the regional district. actually you could ask that question about almost every route |
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Post by keefer on Jul 13, 2007 0:17:21 GMT -8
The case is different for this RD versus the other ones cited. The question is a valid one for Bowen because the Greater Vancouver Transportation Authority (Translink) is mandated to provide for the GVRD and does so with the Albion Ferry and Seabus. But, as mentioned, BCF has the Horseshoe Bay Terminal and one end is a highway... lovin the tongue in cheek stuff, tho ... why not give 'em the Sonia... ooh no.. two words: fixed link! |
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Post by Hardy on Jul 13, 2007 17:42:18 GMT -8
... why not give 'em the Sonia... ooh no.. two words: fixed link! If it were the NorthernSoniaAdventure, it would be the UNFIXED link .... I re-iterate my old argument, BTW, when the Albion/Golden Ears came up -- take those 3 FastCat wanna-be recycled razor-blade boats and park them end-to-end like a floating bridge .... <DARFC> ;D |
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Post by Hardy on Jul 13, 2007 17:51:10 GMT -8
One of the things that strikes me about this forum is that everyone loves the ferry boats, but quite often, those who actually use them regularly, especially those who agitate for better service, are often regarded rather cynically. (I know Hardy's comments were in jest.) Regarding an earlier comment, not all Bowen Islanders are millionaires driving Bentleys. A lot of them are just working people wanting a dependable connection to get into town. Thanks for taking note of that! The thing that sticks in my craw though, is the NIMBY-ness of it all. "We want a bigger boat" "We don't want a bigger terminal" "We don't want to pay higher fares" "We need more reliable service" These ideals cannot co-exist. Yes, they have a gripe about reliability when the Cappie came back with the new RAD package. I think that has all but been sorted out. Is the Cappy the wrong boat for the run? Maybe - I don't think this is the crux of the argument or discussion (lord knows we've analyzed this before and will in the future on a separate thread). As some of my TIC comments though, they are valid -- how are they going to cope with a larger capacity bigger boat offloading at Snug? How large a queue area do they want over there for loading? NIMBY-ism at it's finest. How large a boat can you snuggly fit into Snug Cove anyways? Do we need a buffet and video games on a 20 min crossing? What level of service is appropriate? At what cost? With how much subsidy applied? Are two small vessels with more daily RT's a better solution than one bigger boat? Throw 2 boats 3/4-5/6 the size of the Cappy on the run with lower crewing requirements and a decent propulsion system with "average" ammenities and there's your solution vessel wise. The terminal? Give them all their anti-NIMBY drugs for 2 years and then do it. |
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Post by why on Jul 15, 2007 8:30:26 GMT -8
If Bowen Island is part of the GVRD then why is ferry service being provided by the Province, and not Translink, given that the roads connecting the two areas aren't considered highways... saltspring, the penders, saturna, mayne, and galiano are all part of the capital regional district so you can ask why is the ferry service there part of bc ferries and not the regional district. actually you could ask that question about almost every route A good point, but there are some differences. The transportation responsibilities of the GVTA are greater than that of the Capital Region, and moreover the GVTA has access to far greater resources and already runs a ferry service. |
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Post by nolonger on Jul 15, 2007 16:45:11 GMT -8
One of the things that strikes me about this forum is that everyone loves the ferry boats, but quite often, those who actually use them regularly, especially those who agitate for better service, are often regarded rather cynically. (I know Hardy's comments were in jest.) Regarding an earlier comment, not all Bowen Islanders are millionaires driving Bentleys. A lot of them are just working people wanting a dependable connection to get into town. Exactly. What do they want? To blast the south side of Snug cove off the island and make a not so snug cove?. The only way you're gonna get a bigger boat in there is to totally realign the berth so that it's a straight shot in and out. Build a bridge I say! NIMBY-ism at it's finest. How large a boat can you snuggly fit into Snug Cove anyways? Do we need a buffet and video games on a 20 min crossing? What level of service is appropriate? |
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Not that I think it's a bad idea. 
;D
