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Post by Northern Exploration on Sept 30, 2008 10:07:08 GMT -8
I thought it would be interesting to see informally what everyones plans are for Thursday night.
1. Watch the Canadian Leaders Debate.
2. Watch the US Vice Presidential Debate.
3. Flip back and forth.
4. Watch anything else but the above two.
5. Got other plans.
I am supposed to go to a birthday party and I am sure neither one will be on the agenda there. I am going to record both on PVR and if there is anything interesting in the news coverage I can go back and watch them.
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Post by Mike C on Sept 30, 2008 11:05:24 GMT -8
Well, it's part of my homework to watch the Canadian Leader's Debate...
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Post by Kahloke on Sept 30, 2008 11:24:31 GMT -8
5. Got other plans. I will be in New Hampshire Thursday night so I definitely have other plans.
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Post by Northern Exploration on Sept 30, 2008 11:44:58 GMT -8
Keep rubbing it in  . The leaves are just starting in Toronto so you may see a bit of colour in NH. |
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Post by Political Incorrectness on Sept 30, 2008 12:04:35 GMT -8
Thursday is our vice presidential debate, pailin is in for a tough one unless the media gives her a free ride. Although with FNC scrutinizing McCain, I think it will be a bit more fair.
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Post by Mike C on Sept 30, 2008 12:20:21 GMT -8
Thursday is our vice presidential debate, pailin is in for a tough one unless the media gives her a free ride. Although with FNC scrutinizing McCain, I think it will be a bit more fair. I don't know... you can see Russia from Alaska! |
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Mill Bay
Voyager 
Long Suffering Bosun
Posts: 2,886 
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Post by Mill Bay on Sept 30, 2008 13:31:00 GMT -8
I don't really know how to feel about what gets said in a debate, or who is scrutinizing who for what. I just wish human nature didn't play such a large role in these things. If only there was an honesty commission that could legally enforce them to do exactly what they say they are going to do or not do, to the letter, once they are in office... If they actually knew that what they were saying would literally become reality, then they might finally actually say something that is significant, meaningful and effective. As it is now, these debates can't possibly give a very clear view of who the individuals are and what they really would do if they had the power. The leaders debate is not about providing a concrete foundation, but more about pumping water into each other's sandboxes to see whose playground turns in to quicksand the fastest. But, in the end, they all end up standing in quicksand, Canada even more so than the U.S.
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Nick
Voyager
Chief Engineer - Queen of Richmond
Posts: 2,078
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Post by Nick on Sept 30, 2008 15:00:05 GMT -8
Wow. I think Mill Bay has hit the nail on the head with that one. I have watched both Canadian and American leadership debates in the past, and I really don't think that anything meaningful becomes of them. All it is is a contest to see who can dish out the most BS.
As for what I am doing Thursday night, if I am truly bored and don't have anything better to do, I might watch the Canadian debate. As it stands now, I'm going to be busy.
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,191
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Post by Neil on Sept 30, 2008 16:42:16 GMT -8
No matter what we think of the content of these debates, they can be pivotal in close races, especially on the American side of the border. I wouldn't miss the Palin - Biden tussle on Thursday. It could be great sport.
Will Biden stay on message and not get carried away on flights of fancy like he sometimes does? He's an excellent speaker with a expert grasp of the issues when he maintains his focus. If Sarah Palin displays the stunning incompetence evident in the public forum, and in the Couric debacle, it could be a rout in favour of the Democrats. Still, sadly enough, an utter doofus for a VP doesn't necessarily hurt the ticket, as history has shown with Spiro Agnew and Dan Quayle.
If there was no VP debate, I'd definitely watch the Canadian one. It takes second priority because I know who I'm voting for, and I think I'm aware of most of our leaders' stands on the issues. Even though Layton's party gets my vote, I find him overbearing and monotonously doctrinaire in debate. I can't stand the sight of Stephen Harper, and while Stephane Dion is an intelligent, principled man, he's painful to listen to in English. Elizabeth May and the Greens are basically irrelevant, except for the fact that they're further spintering the center/left vote and helping deliver the election to Harper. There's no suspense here in Canada as to the election outcome this time, other than the question of minority or majority for the Dark Lord.
So, for fun and drama, I'm with the potential VPs on Thursday.
Mill Bay: Can't agree completely with your point about campaign promises. Situations and priorities can change, due to circumstances, as in the current economic 'crisis' on Wall Street. Also, outgoing governments may have misrepresented conditions, and incoming governments may need to adjust their program accordingly. I don't think there's anything intrinsically wrong with altering priorities, if the situation demands it. Opportunism and phony pledges are of course another matter, but I don't quite see how you can legislate on such matters.
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Mill Bay
Voyager
Long Suffering Bosun
Posts: 2,886
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Post by Mill Bay on Sept 30, 2008 19:21:59 GMT -8
So, for fun and drama, I'm with the potential VPs on Thursday. Mill Bay: Can't agree completely with your point about campaign promises. Situations and priorities can change, due to circumstances, as in the current economic 'crisis' on Wall Street. Also, outgoing governments may have misrepresented conditions, and incoming governments may need to adjust their program accordingly. I don't think there's anything intrinsically wrong with altering priorities, if the situation demands it. Opportunism and phony pledges are of course another matter, but I don't quite see how you can legislate on such matters. As I've said in the past... I really don't like making a bunch of cynical political generalizations, because I always feel like I've just hung myself with a very short rope. That was just my perception of leaders' debates as they have been in the past. I'm not sure how much of a Dark Lord Harper is, but I do believe he does not have very good economic sense at this time. He also doesn't strike me as a true conservative and seems to have trouble transforming the values he does have into action, partly due to the functional nature of a minority parliament and also partly due to a somewhat poor judge of economic conditions and what will and will not have the most devastating effect. I'm not going to judge the character of Dion, but I sincerely hope he does not fall into the mold of smug arrogance that past liberal leaders have worn as their mantle. To borrow your words Neil... when it came to the previous two Liberal leaders, I could not even stand to look at their faces. There is no way to legislate human nature however, because circumstances can change, but premeditated dishonesty should have consequences so that they might not write something on wet pavement now and have it set against them later. |
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Post by Mike C on Oct 1, 2008 18:04:48 GMT -8
(just to give you an update as to what I'm doing tomorrow night, apparently I'm going to a Canuck's game...)
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Nick
Voyager
Chief Engineer - Queen of Richmond
Posts: 2,078
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Post by Nick on Oct 1, 2008 18:14:05 GMT -8
What about that homework assignment? We wouldn't want you to fail now...... I'll gladly take that Canucks ticket off your hands for you.
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Post by Curtis on Oct 1, 2008 19:25:05 GMT -8
What am I doing Thursday? Well...
1. Wake Up (Probably a Half Hour Later than I should've got up)
2. School
3. Jazz Choir
4. Dinner
5. (Hopefully) Load New Pictures to the Ship-Rider's Guide
6. Do Whatever Homework I Have (...If Any)
7. Watch TV or Listen to Canucks Preseason Action on the Team 1040.
8. Sleep
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Post by CN2972South on Oct 1, 2008 20:22:16 GMT -8
What am I doing Thursday? Recouperate from Canadian Rail Operating Rules recertification.
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Post by Mike C on Oct 1, 2008 20:24:14 GMT -8
What about that homework assignment? We wouldn't want you to fail now...... I'll gladly take that Canucks ticket off your hands for you. yes, well fortunatley I have the rest of the year's worth of assignments to pull up my grade. sorry Nick, I'll be keeping the tickets safely here. |
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Nick
Voyager
Chief Engineer - Queen of Richmond
Posts: 2,078
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Post by Nick on Oct 1, 2008 21:00:53 GMT -8
ah, darn. I had my hopes up.
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Post by Northern Exploration on Oct 2, 2008 7:32:09 GMT -8
In theory the debates should let you see a less scripted candidate. Although you know for a week or more beforehand, they anticipate the questions and practice scripted answers. However, in the heat of a good debate you hope they go off message a bit and you see the real person come out. There literally is a giant binder(s) called talking points. Once the platform is in place the positive points the candidate wants to make is all written up, and answers to negative questions are framed. An election is a dynamic process so the binder is constantly being fine tuned and updated. Nothing goes into it (in theory) that isn't tested by the party with focus groups and surveys. So a well done campaign is quite a scientific operation.
However, "stuff" happens. The more stuff that happens the more you see off the cuff comments and responses are less scripted and reactions judged live.
That leaves the actual demeanour and perfomance of the individual leader. In the French debate seem to perform as expected with the exception of May coming across a bit better than expected in French. The format of the debate turned it into a bit of a free for all and I think less useful. As well with 5 participants there was less person to person back and forth.
I hope the English language debate is a little more useful and perhaps they put some changes in place for this evening.
* I left off that hopefully you see the candidate stand on their own, less impacted than the particular media bias you normally hear, from whatever your source. Sound bites they often use can be somewhat misleading and the way they comments before and after can alter your perception of the candidate.
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Post by WettCoast on Oct 2, 2008 19:58:26 GMT -8
Debate post mortem - Elizabeth May was the superior performer, but she won't get my vote.
I will vote strategically for the candidate in my riding best placed to prevent the Tories from getting their cherished majority (i.e. 4 year licensed dictatorship). I don't want Mr Harper to have the real power that a majority of seats would provide him.
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Post by CN2972South on Oct 2, 2008 20:10:39 GMT -8
What am I doing Thursday? Recouperate from Canadian Rail Operating Rules recertification. Woohoo! Made it through. 3 years until I have to do it all again. |
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Post by Curtis on Oct 2, 2008 20:31:17 GMT -8
Let's See...
1. Wake Up. / (Probably a Half Hour Later than I should've got up X)
2. School. /
3. Jazz Choir. /
4. Dinner. /
5. (Hopefully) Load New Pictures to the Ship-Rider's Guide. /
6. Do Whatever Homework I Have. / (...If Any. /)
7. Watch TV or Listen to Canucks Preseason Action on the Team 1040. / /
8. Sleep. Yet to be completed
Whoo! Canucks Win 3-2...6-0 Preseason!
Looks like Mikey got to see a good game tonight.
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Post by Mike C on Oct 3, 2008 21:51:09 GMT -8
It was great! We kicked some ass out there. Row 20, center - not too bad  |
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Post by Low Light Mike on Oct 6, 2008 18:14:09 GMT -8
re my vote in the Canadian Federal election:
I'm upset that there is not a proportional-representation system in place. If there were, I'd be able to vote for the party that best represented my beliefs/choices.
However, since we still have a first-past-the-post system, I'm forced to strategically vote, in order to prevent my undesired outcome.
I don't like that.
I also don't like that minority-gov't wasn't allowed to work this past term. It's not surprising that a party leader who squelches collaboration & speaking-out in his own caucus would also be unable / unwilling to work with other parties in a minority situation.
I liked having minority gov'ts. I think a workable minority is a desired outcome for such a diverse nation as Canada.
And yes, I did compare Stephen's eyes to Karla's. ;D
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Post by Balfour on Oct 6, 2008 20:42:04 GMT -8
My take on the election....
If you don't like mudslinging robots, bookworms or Jack Layton running the country, vote rhino!
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Post by Mike C on Oct 8, 2008 11:50:01 GMT -8
My take on the election.... If you don't like mudslinging robots, bookworms or Jack Layton running the country, vote rhino! I find it funny that you dared to insult the Tories and Liberals, and yet not Jack Layton. Even though you would love to see the Rocky Mountains blown to pieces for the Rhino's 26-lane highway, you secretly know you want the NDP... As for me, our liberal candidate has had an alright coutcome without any real trouble. Sukh Daliwal won the Newton North Delta riding for the Liberal Party. |
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Post by Balfour on Oct 8, 2008 12:18:16 GMT -8
Honestly, I'm probably going to end up voting for who I think is the best candidate in the riding that I "officially" live in (as far as the government is concerned, I still live in North Van). With the way things are going I don't think this country will vote another majority for a very long time. My take on the election.... If you don't like mudslinging robots, bookworms or Jack Layton running the country, vote rhino! I find it funny that you dared to insult the Tories and Liberals, and yet not Jack Layton. Even though you would love to see the Rocky Mountains blown to pieces for the Rhino's 26-lane highway, you secretly know you want the NDP... hahahaha I think most people who have been on this forum for the 4 years I've been here know my track record of opinions on the NDP. I've never supported the NDP's platform and probably never will. I'm done slagging the NDP, it's gotten old. The only reason why I suggest the Rhino party is because they are so ridiculous and funny. |
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. The leaves are just starting in Toronto so you may see a bit of colour in NH.
