Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,182
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Post by Neil on Aug 16, 2020 8:39:38 GMT -8
Neil: im not sure how familiar you are with this topic, but the majority of contracts do not require you to sign on the dotted line. you did not simply reserve a vehicle space for a sailing scheduled to depart at a given time. BCF by offering for purchase, and you by accepting that offer de facto entered into a contract. yes, it is perfectly normal for sailings to run off schedule, but unless these exceptions are stipulated in the fine print, this is an example of a breach of contract. you are right to assume few lawyers would argue this before the courts, but their reluctance is not because its a ridiculous reason. im not trying to provoke or agitate you, but ive noticed you are sometimes quite strong replying to certain posts. i apologise for this coming so direct and personal, but is this posturing to show subject authority? or perhaps i should be apologising for misreading the situation entirely? Mike C: i know you jest, so you are entitled to exaggerate, (and please educate me on the forum rules/expectations if you have the time), but are moderators on this forum discouraged from using riddicule? Firstly... you posted an opinion, and people responded. Mine was brief and to the point, and Mike C.'s response was lighthearted. I don't see a need for you to apologize, nor for anyone else to do so. The BC Ferries reservation system has been in effect for many years, and during that time, there have also been many delayed and cancelled sailings. BC Ferries is not under any legal obligation to sail on time, although obviously they do whatever is in their power to keep the schedule. Reservations are honoured for the delayed sailing or possibly the next in the case of a cancellation, or they're refunded, if the customer chooses not to travel. If your understanding of contract law was valid, I'm pretty certain that after all these years of reservations, there would have been a successful challenge to the practise. There hasn't been.
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Post by Scott on Aug 16, 2020 11:25:49 GMT -8
1foot2ships : I'm happy to take time out of my day to highlight our forum rules/expectations and how they apply here: 1. Derailing the SoBC thread with off-topic discussion is unacceptable. 2. Language incapable of promoting respectful discussion is unacceptable. No more warnings will be provided.Moderators: Posting in this thread disabled. I will take care of housekeeping tonight. Six posts moved to reservation discussion.
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Post by Scott on Aug 16, 2020 23:16:27 GMT -8
I’ve attached a screen shot of the conditions you must accept prior to placing a reservation. I'd also like to further emphasize that sailings are scheduled, not "guaranteed to depart at". If the scheduled sailing you reserved departed late with both you and your vehicle aboard, your reservation was exercised fully and completely. Attachments:
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Post by Nickfro on Aug 17, 2020 13:43:23 GMT -8
Anybody aware of how BCF Reservation system is operating during these Covid times? I was looking to book for mid October but all sailings are closed. I have to assume they are not fully booked, so perhaps they are waiting to confirm what the exact schedule will be, or a glitch occurring with their system, or I'll continue to keep tabs on this, but looking for local knowledge, if any. Thanks!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 15:16:02 GMT -8
Anybody aware of how BCF Reservation system is operating during these Covid times? I was looking to book for mid October but all sailings are closed. I have to assume they are not fully booked, so perhaps they are waiting to confirm what the exact schedule will be, or a glitch occurring with their system, or I'll continue to keep tabs on this, but looking for local knowledge, if any. Thanks! Read the print in red on the schedule. www.bcferries.com/schedules/mainland/hbna-current.php
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Post by Low Light Mike on Mar 3, 2021 9:39:13 GMT -8
The beginnings of a new fare structure were announced today, including new jargon such as "Saver Fare." Press Release here: Link H E R E
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Post by Mike C on Mar 3, 2021 17:12:38 GMT -8
The beginnings of a new fare structure were announced today, including new jargon such as "Saver Fare." I suspect that this is part of a broader fare structure review that BCF will be rolling out over the next few years, but just wanted to get down some thoughts while riding the buzz of an afternoon steeped tea: I do appreciate the effort they are making to more evenly spread passenger loads by incentivizing travel during off peak periods. I think that, generally, this is a good thing; incentivizing reservations and reducing peak loads makes travel patterns more predictable and easier to manage from an operational perspective. But, there are some reasons that I don't think this goes far enough. It's unfortunate that this also did not include discounts for passenger-only fares. I understand that the incentives are different, given that overloads for foot passengers are rare and only happen during particular seasons. However, I think that BCF should be incentivizing foot passenger travel, given the contribution it would make in reducing emissions, and also congestion on cities like Victoria and Nanaimo, among others. I've commented on here before about the lack of cohesive transit connections at terminals for foot passengers. I believe that, once again, we should be looking at WSF as an example for how this is done. In the Puget Sound area, the ORCA (One Regional Card for All) card is accepted on both a variety of Puget Sound transit systems and on WSF. TransLink's Compass program presents a great opportunity to explore this in BC, both on the ferries and on the regional transit systems around the South Coast (in particular Victoria, Nanaimo, Comox, Powell River, and Sunshine Coast, among others). I think that having a cohesive fare structure and singular payment method that includes discounts (targeting Experience Card users here) would be a real net benefit to converting a lot of that peak period overcrowding into foot passenger traffic. This of course must include high-quality, usable transit connections at either end - looking at you, Duke Point.
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Post by northwesterner on Mar 3, 2021 18:27:27 GMT -8
The beginnings of a new fare structure were announced today, including new jargon such as "Saver Fare." I suspect that this is part of a broader fare structure review that BCF will be rolling out over the next few years, but just wanted to get down some thoughts while riding the buzz of an afternoon steeped tea: I do appreciate the effort they are making to more evenly spread passenger loads by incentivizing travel during off peak periods. I think that, generally, this is a good thing; incentivizing reservations and reducing peak loads makes travel patterns more predictable and easier to manage from an operational perspective. But, there are some reasons that I don't think this goes far enough. It's unfortunate that this also did not include discounts for passenger-only fares. I understand that the incentives are different, given that overloads for foot passengers are rare and only happen during particular seasons. However, I think that BCF should be incentivizing foot passenger travel, given the contribution it would make in reducing emissions, and also congestion on cities like Victoria and Nanaimo, among others. I've commented on here before about the lack of cohesive transit connections at terminals for foot passengers. I believe that, once again, we should be looking at WSF as an example for how this is done. In the Puget Sound area, the ORCA (One Regional Card for All) card is accepted on both a variety of Puget Sound transit systems and on WSF. TransLink's Compass program presents a great opportunity to explore this in BC, both on the ferries and on the regional transit systems around the South Coast (in particular Victoria, Nanaimo, Comox, Powell River, and Sunshine Coast, among others). I think that having a cohesive fare structure and singular payment method that includes discounts (targeting Experience Card users here) would be a real net benefit to converting a lot of that peak period overcrowding into foot passenger traffic. This of course must include high-quality, usable transit connections at either end - looking at you, Duke Point. I should go dig up my post where I strongly suggested they should do this as a response to "four sailing waits" on weekends at major terminals to incentivize people to chose off hours sailings to travel like five years ago. I seem to remember getting a lot of pushback on this forum that BCF is transportation infrastructure and shouldn't be priced like a hotel room or an airline. Oh well - the future is here.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Mar 3, 2021 19:34:24 GMT -8
I should go dig up my post where I strongly suggested they should do this as a response to "four sailing waits" on weekends at major terminals to incentivize people to chose off hours sailings to travel like five years ago. I seem to remember getting a lot of pushback on this forum that BCF is transportation infrastructure and shouldn't be priced like a hotel room or an airline. Oh well - the future is here. I disagree on this opinion because fares should be based on demand look at some transit authorities and toll roads have varied pricing on the day or time of day. How BC Ferries is approaching it is wrong, I think, the reduce pricing should be available at the terminals too because I think that would encourage more spread out wait times on routes. I personally want every southern route in system to switch a variable pricing since demand in winter should warrant a high fare compared to peak season to help gain additional capacity to routes. What high fare in peak season would get shuttle mode activations on Hornby and Denman routes possibly the Campbell River to Quadra Island route with Island Class, additional round trips on the long minor routes and two additional round trips short minor routes. The high fare on major routes would get longer weekend summer schedule for June to Thanksgiving weekend on all routes, route 1 would have same summer schedule, additional sailing for route 2 on top of summer schedule and Queen of Coquitlam would get full day all week service on route 3 during the summer season, this doesn’t change the long term plan for full year two boat service on route 3. For Southern Gulf Island the high fare in peak season would keep the same schedule for route 9 but additional round trip on both route 5 vessels. I think transportation infrastructure should have varied pricing because people should pay the same price when demand doesn’t warrant the high prices for busy times, but busy time should see less than 30% increase over busy times.
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,182
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Post by Neil on Mar 3, 2021 20:51:26 GMT -8
The beginnings of a new fare structure were announced today, including new jargon such as "Saver Fare." I suspect that this is part of a broader fare structure review that BCF will be rolling out over the next few years, but just wanted to get down some thoughts while riding the buzz of an afternoon steeped tea: I do appreciate the effort they are making to more evenly spread passenger loads by incentivizing travel during off peak periods. I think that, generally, this is a good thing; incentivizing reservations and reducing peak loads makes travel patterns more predictable and easier to manage from an operational perspective. But, there are some reasons that I don't think this goes far enough. It's unfortunate that this also did not include discounts for passenger-only fares. I understand that the incentives are different, given that overloads for foot passengers are rare and only happen during particular seasons. However, I think that BCF should be incentivizing foot passenger travel, given the contribution it would make in reducing emissions, and also congestion on cities like Victoria and Nanaimo, among others. I've commented on here before about the lack of cohesive transit connections at terminals for foot passengers. I believe that, once again, we should be looking at WSF as an example for how this is done. In the Puget Sound area, the ORCA (One Regional Card for All) card is accepted on both a variety of Puget Sound transit systems and on WSF. TransLink's Compass program presents a great opportunity to explore this in BC, both on the ferries and on the regional transit systems around the South Coast (in particular Victoria, Nanaimo, Comox, Powell River, and Sunshine Coast, among others). I think that having a cohesive fare structure and singular payment method that includes discounts (targeting Experience Card users here) would be a real net benefit to converting a lot of that peak period overcrowding into foot passenger traffic. This of course must include high-quality, usable transit connections at either end - looking at you, Duke Point. "Riding the buzz of an afternoon steeped tea"? I think the moderators should step in here and curb the promotion of hard drugs. This is a family site, Michael. I very much agree with making the occasional off peak travel promotions permanent, although time will tell how much this might affect traffic patterns. I know that for me, over the decades, I've travelled at times that worked for me, and a discount to get on a ferry in the late evening wouldn't have been a factor. It may be, though, for many others. It just makes sense to try to utilize lower traffic sailings by incentivizing them; in making the system as efficient as possible, this hasn't been done enough. Very much agree also with your point about connecting modes of transit more efficiently. Vancouver Island, for instance, is a patchwork quilt of local systems with gaps in between, and a withering of the former long haul carriers. Along with your suggestion of incentives for foot passengers on the ferries, there needs to be regional strategies for transit which might include linking the growing population south of the Fraser River and Vancouver Island, through Duke Point. It seems odd to me that certain areas are blessed with transit that carries next to no passengers (i.e. the 350 route in my area) where other regions seem to have a dearth of even a vision of how transit use might grow, given time.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Mar 8, 2021 18:46:55 GMT -8
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Post by hwy19man on Apr 22, 2021 12:45:39 GMT -8
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Apr 22, 2021 17:40:12 GMT -8
I think this will be epic failure with wait time remaining or increasing because no matter what you will need to go to terminal early to calm your reservation.
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Post by arrrrmatey on Apr 23, 2021 6:35:14 GMT -8
Does anyone know if they have taken Powell River travellers into consideration here? While I have been in favour of 100% (or close to) reservations for some time, I am concerned that reservations will still sell out weeks in advance, making it impossible for people heading to or from Powell River to get through route 3.... resulting in a bunch of angry people waiting on standby hoping for unclaimed reservation spots and then needing to get a hotel. I don’t think it would be unreasonable to set aside ~100AEQ reservations on route 3 that would be guaranteed connection to/from Powell River. Well, guaranteed as long as you don’t stop for any length of time in Sechelt or Gibsons. This would get you a reservation at Saltery Bay as well as Langdale. Heading North I see no need for reservations at Earls Cove, just at HSB. Then, any space that is not booked will become standby or otherwise reservable within maybe a few hours of sailing time.
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Post by Kahloke on Apr 23, 2021 7:22:40 GMT -8
Does anyone know if they have taken Powell River travellers into consideration here? While I have been in favour of 100% (or close to) reservations for some time, I am concerned that reservations will still sell out weeks in advance, making it impossible for people heading to or from Powell River to get through route 3.... resulting in a bunch of angry people waiting on standby hoping for unclaimed reservation spots and then needing to get a hotel. I don’t think it would be unreasonable to set aside ~100AEQ reservations on route 3 that would be guaranteed connection to/from Powell River. Well, guaranteed as long as you don’t stop for any length of time in Sechelt or Gibsons. This would get you a reservation at Saltery Bay as well as Langdale. Heading North I see no need for reservations at Earls Cove, just at HSB. Then, any space that is not booked will become standby or otherwise reservable within maybe a few hours of sailing time. Reservations selling out weeks, or even months, in advance was a concern for island residents when WSF introduced reservations between Anacortes and Orcas and Friday Harbor. Their solution was to release blocks of reservations at preset intervals to prevent all of the spaces being reserved far in advance. 90% of the sailing can be reserved. The first 30% of the vessel can be reserved up to 3 months in advance, the next 30% is released 2 weeks in advance, and the last 30% opens up 2 days before the sailing. 10% is always left over for medical emergencies and standbys. I think the system is working ok, and I'm not sure if such a system would work for Route 3, but it would be better than simply allowing the entire sailing to be reserved weeks or months in advance.
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Post by arrrrmatey on Apr 23, 2021 7:29:40 GMT -8
Does anyone know if they have taken Powell River travellers into consideration here? While I have been in favour of 100% (or close to) reservations for some time, I am concerned that reservations will still sell out weeks in advance, making it impossible for people heading to or from Powell River to get through route 3.... resulting in a bunch of angry people waiting on standby hoping for unclaimed reservation spots and then needing to get a hotel. I don’t think it would be unreasonable to set aside ~100AEQ reservations on route 3 that would be guaranteed connection to/from Powell River. Well, guaranteed as long as you don’t stop for any length of time in Sechelt or Gibsons. This would get you a reservation at Saltery Bay as well as Langdale. Heading North I see no need for reservations at Earls Cove, just at HSB. Then, any space that is not booked will become standby or otherwise reservable within maybe a few hours of sailing time. Reservations selling out weeks, or even months, in advance was a concern for island residents when WSF introduced reservations between Anacortes and Orcas and Friday Harbor. Their solution was to release blocks of reservations at preset intervals to prevent all of the spaces being reserved far in advance. 90% of the sailing can be reserved. The first 30% of the vessel can be reserved up to 3 months in advance, the next 30% is released 2 weeks in advance, and the last 30% opens up 2 days before the sailing. 10% is always left over for medical emergencies and standbys. I think the system is working ok, and I'm not sure if such a system would work for Route 3, but it would be better than simply allowing the entire sailing to be reserved weeks or months in advance. This seems like it might be a good idea. Not everyone can plan that far in advance, but 2 days for the last block is probably fine. I would imagine that if you are required to pay the full fare in advance in order to secure a reservation then you won’t have people booking a Friday afternoon sailing every week just in case they want to go.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Apr 26, 2021 21:17:13 GMT -8
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Apr 30, 2021 15:16:49 GMT -8
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Jun 23, 2021 23:23:16 GMT -8
When did BC Ferries start accepting foot passenger reservation on major routes?
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Jun 24, 2021 13:37:08 GMT -8
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Post by Charles on Jun 24, 2021 18:52:37 GMT -8
I think it’s more a quality of life thing and not a necessity. If you don’t want to wait in any lines when you’re a foot passenger then all you have to do is reserve, but yes I don’t know any instances of walk on passenger waits. If anyone does please enlighten?
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Jun 24, 2021 19:53:52 GMT -8
I think it’s more a quality of life thing and not a necessity. If you don’t want to wait in any lines when you’re a foot passenger then all you have to do is reserve, but yes I don’t know any instances of walk on passenger waits. If anyone does please enlighten? You still need to redeem the prepaid at kiosk or tickets agent.
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Post by Charles on Jun 24, 2021 21:12:24 GMT -8
I think it’s more a quality of life thing and not a necessity. If you don’t want to wait in any lines when you’re a foot passenger then all you have to do is reserve, but yes I don’t know any instances of walk on passenger waits. If anyone does please enlighten? You still need to redeem the prepaid at kiosk or tickets agent. I’m assuming there would be a reserved line up for people who have already paid and just need proof of purchase. It’s not meant to be revolutionary just something to speed up the process. For example say you had people going on a field trip or just any amount of people going on a group trip, you already have everyone paid for and it’s overall less stress.
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Post by 1foot2ships on Jul 9, 2021 12:33:07 GMT -8
Though they are rare, it can happen! Every sailing has a foot passenger traffic quota. This quota is different for each ship and different for each sailing so one vessel's passenger quota on it's 3rd run of the day could be completely different than its passenger quota on its 6th run. It is never a hard number you can pin down. The variables are the amount of vehicles projected and their passenger counts. One thing which is guaranteed though, is if the ticket booth sold you a ticket, you will not be held for the next sailing. When foot passenger quotas are reached, toll booths simply stop selling tickets. * * * Overall... I think giving foot passengers the option to reserve is stupid. Sure, it gives predictability to the ferry system, and potentially introduces another revenue stream, but if you don't have an idea when peak travel periods are by now, you probably deserve the criticism people direct at you. Additionally, this just causes more problems for the toll booth agents when they have to explain why others arriving after them are permitted through when they are denied.
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,182
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Post by Neil on Apr 13, 2022 14:05:58 GMT -8
Service cancellations keep coming, and there's no indication that enough staff is going to materialize over the summer to ease the shortage. Seems to me that BC Ferries should be lowering the price of reservations, since reservations are no longer a guarantee that you are going to get on a given sailing.
I understand that when sailings are cancelled, people get their fees back. That doesn't change the fact that when you lose your sailing, you are pretty much put back in the queue with all the non-reserved traffic. Doesn't matter whether you've got a medical appointment or some important function. You're screwed. They will try to get you on the next available sailing, but all reserved traffic for that sailing has priority over the cancelled reserved traffic.
Until BC Ferries fixes their staffing shortage, reservations no longer have the same value, and a lower price should reflect that.
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