Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,196
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Post by Neil on Mar 22, 2022 8:37:26 GMT -8
Are you familiar with the vehicle space constraints at Fulford Harbour? Where would you keep three to four vessels on Fulford Harbour? I think might make harder to fix since there would be longer lines though out day because both vessels are take half capacity at a time, it’s not capacity for future. "Where would you keep three to four vessels on Fulford Harbour?" Sorry, no idea what you're saying here.
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Post by Kahloke on Mar 22, 2022 8:53:49 GMT -8
Where would you keep three to four vessels on Fulford Harbour? I think might make harder to fix since there would be longer lines though out day because both vessels are take half capacity at a time, it’s not capacity for future. "Where would you keep three to four vessels on Fulford Harbour?" Sorry, no idea what you're saying here. Skeena Queen overnights at Fulford, and has an island-based crew, correct? If BC Ferries were ever to add an additional vessel to Route 4, I would expect the 2nd vessel to be based out of Swartz Bay. Are there any available berths at Swartz for an overnight layover? Typically, you would have (2) Route 1 vessels overnighting there, and both Route 5 vessels overnight at Swartz Bay, right?
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Mar 22, 2022 9:44:00 GMT -8
"Where would you keep three to four vessels on Fulford Harbour?" Sorry, no idea what you're saying here. Skeena Queen overnights at Fulford, and has an island-based crew, correct? If BC Ferries were ever to add an additional vessel to Route 4, I would expect the 2nd vessel to be based out of Swartz Bay. Are there any available berths at Swartz for an overnight layover? Typically, you would have (2) Route 1 vessels overnighting there, and both Route 5 vessels overnight at Swartz Bay, right? If you look Swartz Bay all berth will be used tonight because there are two Coastal Class vessels their right now. So BC Ferries might need to think more creative on Coastal vessel maintenance locations.
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,196
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Post by Neil on Mar 22, 2022 13:49:35 GMT -8
"Where would you keep three to four vessels on Fulford Harbour?" Sorry, no idea what you're saying here. Skeena Queen overnights at Fulford, and has an island-based crew, correct? If BC Ferries were ever to add an additional vessel to Route 4, I would expect the 2nd vessel to be based out of Swartz Bay. Are there any available berths at Swartz for an overnight layover? Typically, you would have (2) Route 1 vessels overnighting there, and both Route 5 vessels overnight at Swartz Bay, right? There is already a tie-up berth at Fulford, which has been used by Quinitsa and Bowen Queen in recent years.
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Post by Kahloke on Mar 22, 2022 14:09:48 GMT -8
Skeena Queen overnights at Fulford, and has an island-based crew, correct? If BC Ferries were ever to add an additional vessel to Route 4, I would expect the 2nd vessel to be based out of Swartz Bay. Are there any available berths at Swartz for an overnight layover? Typically, you would have (2) Route 1 vessels overnighting there, and both Route 5 vessels overnight at Swartz Bay, right? There is already a tie-up berth at Fulford, which has been used by Quinitsa and Bowen Queen in recent years. OK, so 2-vessel service IS possible there, with island based crews. I won't hold my breath waiting for that to happen, but nice to know it's feasible with the current shore facilities.
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Post by explorer on Mar 22, 2022 22:14:57 GMT -8
To be honest I think BC Ferries should add two car 100-118 vessels with passengers lounge such as on Queen of Capilano or Malaspina Sky on both route 4, and 8 to keep up the future demand on the routes. I don’t see two Island Class vessels working that will on both of theses routes due the 94 vehicles an hour that already happens with one vessel for future growth these routes might require three or four Island Class just to keep up with demand of route which in the end may cause more chaos compared to two 100-118 vessels. I can see Skeena Queen being moved to route 6 in future to replace Quinsam have larger vessel take over route 4. Moving the Skeena onto Route 6 simply exacerbates Ferry Traffic Gridlock. Vesuvius or Crofton are Gridlocked now. Frequency is the cure. The Corp has spent $295 Million for 5 New Vessel Services this Spring, but refuse to spend a dime on expanding Car Park Containment Ares since 1975 on Salt Spring. Population touching 12,000. 1975 - 8000.
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Post by explorer on Mar 22, 2022 22:25:37 GMT -8
There is already a tie-up berth at Fulford, which has been used by Quinitsa and Bowen Queen in recent years. OK, so 2-vessel service IS possible there, with island based crews. I won't hold my breath waiting for that to happen, but nice to know it's feasible with the current shore facilities. Either Vessel could be tied up (which depends on load demand) in Fulford at the tie up berth after Peak Demand subsides - roughly 1900. The same option exists for Route 19 with the advent of the 2 - New Island Class Vessels. The same for goes for Route 6. Where would the Tie Up Berth be located? Wherever they decide to locate the Crews, one would assume Crofton.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Mar 22, 2022 22:39:31 GMT -8
To be honest I think BC Ferries should add two car 100-118 vessels with passengers lounge such as on Queen of Capilano or Malaspina Sky on both route 4, and 8 to keep up the future demand on the routes. I don’t see two Island Class vessels working that will on both of theses routes due the 94 vehicles an hour that already happens with one vessel for future growth these routes might require three or four Island Class just to keep up with demand of route which in the end may cause more chaos compared to two 100-118 vessels. I can see Skeena Queen being moved to route 6 in future to replace Quinsam have larger vessel take over route 4. Moving the Skeena onto Route 6 simply exacerbates Ferry Traffic Gridlock. Vesuvius or Crofton are Gridlocked now. Frequency is the cure. The Corp has spent $295 Million for 5 New Vessel Services this Spring, but refuse to spend a dime on expanding Car Park Containment Ares since 1975 on Salt Spring. Population touching 12,000. 1975 - 8000. If the add another lane at Vesuvius to 29 vehicles on planed trestle that could 14 which the terminal could 93 vehicles at time. At Crofton they could add two lanes which on 32 car trestle including the 70 car holding area which could 102 vehicles at time. The terminal updates and changes would add even more capacity to terminal which these number could barely enough vehicles per sailing with Skeena Queen.
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Post by explorer on Mar 22, 2022 23:01:08 GMT -8
Here's the issue on Salt Spring Island that has developed over the last decade:
Route 6 - Currently using MV Quinitsa - 44 AEQ (Automobile Equivalent - 20' Length).
The MV Quinsam - 63 AEQ will give welcomed relief in the shoulder season. Come June, July, August & September it's same old issue, lack of capacity. Up 2 AEQ from the Bowen Queen - 61 AEQ last Summer (Operation Gridlock).
Vesuvius Bay ~ 45 Car Parks, Full Load 63 = 18 x 20’ = 360’ of cars lined up East along Vesuvius Bay Rd.
Crofton ~ 38 Car Park, Full Load 63 = 25 x 20’ = 500’ of cars lined up on Chaplin Rd.
2022 is another Summer of Discontent Pending - Traffic Gridlock and Sailing Waits with Traffic up 19% from Pre Pandemic levels.
Route 4 - Currently using MV Skeena Queen - 92 AEQ.
Fulford Car Parks ~ 60, Full Load 92 = 32 x 20' = 640' of cars lined up on Fulford-Ganges Rd.
The interesting bit, Traffic on Route 4 is stagnant or slight decrease from Pre Pandemic levels.
With Full Sailings there's traffic gridlock preventing two way traffic at all 3 Terminals.
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Post by explorer on Mar 23, 2022 8:47:20 GMT -8
Moving the Skeena onto Route 6 simply exacerbates Ferry Traffic Gridlock. Vesuvius or Crofton are Gridlocked now. Frequency is the cure. The Corp has spent $295 Million for 5 New Vessel Services this Spring, but refuse to spend a dime on expanding Car Park Containment Ares since 1975 on Salt Spring. Population touching 12,000. 1975 - 8000. If the add another lane at Vesuvius to 29 vehicles on planed trestle that could 14 which the terminal could 93 vehicles at time. At Crofton they could add two lanes which on 32 car trestle including the 70 car holding area which could 102 vehicles at time. The terminal updates and changes would add even more capacity to terminal which these number could barely enough vehicles per sailing with Skeena Queen. Blue Bus, We like the way you think. However the numbers have been done by the Terminal Design Team. The Final Draft was completed 2020 and waiting for funding. We won't see any Terminal improvements until at least 2027. That's another 5 years of Traffic Gridlock at Vesuvius and Crofton. It's patently unreasonable. The current Parking Containment Area is 45 AEQ. The planned parking for a 3rd lane on the New Trestle is 25 AEQ. Providing a total of 70 AEQ. The MV Quinsam is planned on Route 6 until 2035. It's stated that it will provide adequate service. Meanwhile with with 63 AEQ this Summer with no plan to promised improvements to Service. Patrons are simply bracing themselves for another Summer of Ferry Traffic Mayhem on both sides Stuart Channel. BCF Ferries have had no less than 3 opportunities to purchase the Former Vesuvius Pub and still do at an inflated price. That would resolve the Parking Containment Issue for the next 47 years. It's not that BCF has neglected Route 6, they've simply abandoned us for years.
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Post by explorer on Mar 23, 2022 8:55:11 GMT -8
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Post by Ferryman on Apr 6, 2022 21:05:21 GMT -8
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Post by WettCoast on Apr 9, 2022 11:54:00 GMT -8
There has been some discussion on the BC Nautical history FB page re the introduction of the Island class vessels on the Gabriola & Quadra routes. There have been some suggestions re excessive issues (i.e. reliability) of these vessels, particularly with reference to the Texada run. It is not uncommon for new vessels to have 'teething' issues. To my knowledge these Island class vessels so far have been working out fairly well, but I am far from the action. So I am asking others such as Curtis if there is any substance to suggestions that reliability is an issue with these new vessels.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Apr 9, 2022 12:25:24 GMT -8
Island Aurora is very reliable because there has been service notices about her cancelling sailing for her being broken down. I think first vessels of new class always has issues compared to the rest of her sisters.
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Post by explorer on Apr 11, 2022 14:20:29 GMT -8
Will the 2 - New Island Class & 1 - Salish Class Vessels sit idle for the Summer or will they be cycled in and out service until they are operated full time in the Fall?
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Apr 17, 2022 20:18:58 GMT -8
Will BC Ferries switch the ports of Island Class on Nanaimo Harbour - Gabriola Island to make sure they have same amount of hours on engines?
Also we need Island Gwawis thread in current fleet sub-board.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on May 1, 2022 20:26:01 GMT -8
I wonder what time line for phrase 3 of Island Class? I predicting the following time: 2023-2024: Eight more Island Class Award. 2026: First new vessels takes over Hornby Island route retiring Kahloke. 2027: Second vessel takes over Cortes Island retiring Quinitsa. 2028: Third vessels retired Quadra Queen II becoming Northern minor vessel back up/ relief. Two Island Class vessels coming to route 6 retiring the Quinsam. 2029: Seventy vessel coming route 20 moving Kuper to Mill Bay route and retiring the Klitsa. Eighth vessel retiring Tachek becoming the Southern minor back up/ relief.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on May 2, 2022 12:30:06 GMT -8
Who owns the design of Island Class? If BC Ferries owns the design how is Damen Group marketing them of Damen Road Ferry 8117 E3?
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,196
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Post by Neil on May 2, 2022 21:08:40 GMT -8
Who owns the design of Island Class? If BC Ferries owns the design how is Damen Group marketing them of Damen Road Ferry 8117 E3? Blue Bus Fan, if you look at the Damen website, I guess you get your answer. These are generic ferries that might be found in BC, Norway, Croatia, Scotland, Japan... It's the new era. No more quirky North Island Princess or Mill Bay or, heaven forbid, Queen of Chilliwack. As Mark Collins happily said, "The only way you'll know what ferry you're on is by the name". Onward and upward, I guess.
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Post by Kahn_C on May 2, 2022 21:18:37 GMT -8
Who owns the design of Island Class? If BC Ferries owns the design how is Damen Group marketing them of Damen Road Ferry 8117 E3? BC Ferries probably licensed the design from Damen, but I doubt anyone but Damen will be able to compete on construction of them anyway seeing how they're essentially a Damen standard item.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on May 2, 2022 22:54:34 GMT -8
Who owns the design of Island Class? If BC Ferries owns the design how is Damen Group marketing them of Damen Road Ferry 8117 E3? BC Ferries probably licensed the design from Damen, but I doubt anyone but Damen will be able to compete on construction of them anyway seeing how they're essentially a Damen standard item. Wouldn’t that go against standardization plan because only one shipyard can build the whole fleet which they could charge premium for. Maybe BC Ferries let Deman do code name.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on May 2, 2022 22:57:17 GMT -8
Who owns the design of Island Class? If BC Ferries owns the design how is Damen Group marketing them of Damen Road Ferry 8117 E3? Blue Bus Fan, if you look at the Damen website, I guess you get your answer. These are generic ferries that might be found in BC, Norway, Croatia, Scotland, Japan... It's the new era. No more quirky North Island Princess or Mill Bay or, heaven forbid, Queen of Chilliwack. As Mark Collins happily said, "The only way you'll know what ferry you're on is by the name". Onward and upward, I guess. But so far BC Ferries has order them so far. BC Ferries has said these vessels could be built locally and doubt BC Ferries wants to pay premium on the design.
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Post by Kahn_C on May 3, 2022 8:20:14 GMT -8
BC Ferries probably licensed the design from Damen, but I doubt anyone but Damen will be able to compete on construction of them anyway seeing how they're essentially a Damen standard item. Wouldn’t that go against standardization plan because only one shipyard can build the whole fleet which they could charge premium for. Maybe BC Ferries let Deman do code name. If BC Ferries has a design license, then they could build them anywhere (pending the actual license terms of course, it could in theory require something like "Damen associated" status for the local yard(s)).
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Post by explorer on May 9, 2022 13:25:49 GMT -8
Are the New Island Class Ferries the right size? Route 19 will perhaps demonstrate that this year, when peak demand hits June thru September. The vessels are currently on turn around times of about 35 Min, which seems is about as fast as its going to happen.
"I wonder what time line for phrase 3 of Island Class? I predicting the following time:
2023-2024: Eight more Island Class Award. 2026: First new vessels takes over Hornby Island route retiring Kahloke. 2027: Second vessel takes over Cortes Island retiring Quinitsa. 2028: Third vessels retired Quadra Queen II becoming Northern minor vessel back up/ relief. Two Island Class vessels coming to route 6 retiring the Quinsam. 2029: Seventy vessel coming route 20 moving Kuper to Mill Bay route and retiring the Klitsa. Eighth vessel retiring Tachek becoming the Southern minor back up/ relief."
We were told we wouldn't see the next tranche of Island Class Vessels (6) until 2030 at the earliest. I like the way you think though and that was 4 months ago.
The Quinsam is gratefully appreciated on Route 6. The ease of loading and unloading is a treat. The problem - insufficient capacity during peak demand. The addition of the Quinitsa is the icing on the cake until 2030. We are up 2 (AEQ) vehicles from last Summer (Bowen Queen).
Another Summer of Traffic Gridlock and Sailing Waits on Route 6 Vesuvius - Crofton.
4th in a row.
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Post by explorer on May 14, 2022 13:35:22 GMT -8
Island Class - MV Island Nagalis
Show's anchored or on a tie up just North of Quathiaski Cove, Quadra Island.
Is it in Service or at Rest? Thanks.
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