Debate: WMG takeover?

[Political Incorrectness]

I have been wondering, if BCF got bought out by WMG and became a subsidiary of WMG, would that be a good decision? Could this be a win for patrons and to reduce the fares to promote travel? Would it promote people to stay on the Gulf Islands instead of making it for rich people?

[Low Light Mike]

How hypothetical is this debate?

Do you want us to assume that WMG can legally "buy out" the company called B.C. Ferry Services Inc.; even though that would be legally impossible under the structure of BC Ferries?

So are you talking about WMG winning the contracts to serve individual existing routes?

Now onto issue #2: re the impact on fares. In my unlearned opinion, I don't think fares would ever go down......I think they are still a good deal, in light of what competition would be able to offer. So I don't think there's a fare-argument.

And is your premise that current Gulf Island residents are moving away, because they can't afford the ferry fares?

that's my opening 2 cents.......

[Neil]

Interesting question, Dan, although, as 'Nanaimo suggested, it's framed too broadly to really get into specifics. I imagine your curiosity was piqued by the recent takeover by WMG of the Esquimalt & Nanaimo Railway, and by peoples' hopes for a revitalization of Island rail operations because of it.

I don't think Dennis Washington would have much interest in most of BC Ferries' operations. The vast majority of our ferry routes are operated as a public service, with no opportunity for a profit, unless with a massive subsidy. There is no growth potential on the Texada Island route, or Thetis Island, or most of the others. And the governing body overseeing coastal ferry operations mandates that all those routes need to be maintained, along with the couple of profitable ones.

The E & N has been neglected for decades, and WMG saw the potential for gaining back some freight revenue that had been lost to the trucking industry, and for a synergy with their Seaspan ferry operations. Island rail operations will never be a goldmine for WMG, but they could be a steady source of income, with the right management, and some capital investment.

I don't even think that a private enterprise zealot like Gordon Campbell has much interest in dumping BC Ferries. He's already got his phony baloney privatization, and why bother selling off public assets when you're just going to end up paying perhaps even a higher subsidy than you're currently paying, in order to interest a firm like WMG?

The paying customer, at least those on the less lucrative routes, would never gain from privatization. WMG, or any other operator, would apply to charge the highest fares possible to cover the cost of the unprofitable routes. Or, perhaps the subsidy would go up, in which case all taxpayers would pay.

Of course, like 'Nanaimo, my input is worth about two cents, and it could be that at this very moment Dennis Washington is sharing a bottle of scotch with Gordon Campbell (oops! sorry Gord!), and preparing to paint all those BC Ferries funnels red... maybe we'll see the 'Alberni docking at Tilbury Island any day now.

[hergfest]

I don't think the citizens of BC would allow it. BC Ferries was created because of the failure of a private ferry company, and although they call themselves private now they really aren't.

[Political Incorrectness]

It was not because of the railway takeover, moreso funding for projects. Due to that it is a private company, the government cannot fund it as much, also, minor route fares are extremely high, not the major routes. The minor route fares need to be lowered or some may move out and just gives an opportunity for the rich to move onto the island due to the fact they can afford high fares. I am not sure if it would be to the point that the rich would complain if they lived on the islands.
I am not saying WMG can legally buy out BCF, I am just curious if it were to happen. You do remember that an American is running this operation and has not been doing his job as well as I had expected, it is also a private company meaning some things can be kept under the cover right?
herg, how are they not private? give me your reasons why they are not "private"

[Neil]

Nope, it sure doesn't make sense. For the same reason that it doesn't make sense that anyone would want to own 49% of Washington State Ferries, and 49% of BC Ferries.

[Neil]

My neighbours on Hornby Island would no doubt be flattered, and amused, to have their humble little ferry service compared to trans atlantic flights on BA, although, aside from the fact that they both carry passengers, I confess I'm baffled as to what the analogy is.

Dan: leaving aside the alphabet soup of different ferry bodies, the bottom line is that the government owns the BC Ferries assets, and the company is operated on a business model, as opposed to being purely a public service. As to it being 'private', that's partly a load of rubbish, meant to calm tax-o-phobes in Penticton who might be worried that their dollars are going to unduly subsidize pot smoking hippies on Cortes Island.

It might not be out of the realm of possibility for WMG to start up a limited passenger service from their own terminal at Tilbury Island to Nanaimo- but probably unlikely.

[BrianWilliams]

Pursuing the airline argument for a moment:

KLM and BA, to cite those two examples, are quite different from what they were 30 years ago. Both have abandoned much of their short-haul services. BOAC's BEA (British European Airways) division has disappeared, replaced by a mass of cut-rate fliers like DanAir, Caledonian and RyanAir.

KLM's western European network is now Martin Air (and perhaps others), while all domestic European flying is seriously challenged by high-speed trains - and the increasing speedy ferry links.

Privatized Air Canada may be the worst model for a privatized BC Ferries. AC absorbed all the domestic competition by the 1990's, then failed abysmally to make money and provide decent service.

WestJet is now a shining star, filling some of the gaps that AC created ... but we had a healthier industry before 1986, when PWA, CP Air, Wardair and Eastern Provincial served Canada well, alongside the state airline.

If I have my 'druthers: BC Ferries will continue as the prime carrier of passengers and private autos on the mainline hauls, earning enough to subsidize the minor routes.

I'll be very happy to see private operators expand commercial truck/barge services to Vancouver Island; and especially pleased to see innovative passenger-only operators working Howe Sound and trans-Georgia runs.

HarbourLynx was the latest brave effort. It's an expensive game, and HarbourLynx's pockets were not quite deep enough. HL needed two vessels to get frequency of service up to snuff; and perhaps a third to ensure against mechanical failure.