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Post by old_wsf_fan on Mar 10, 2007 7:55:20 GMT -8
According to the WSF website, all sailings on the PT./Keystone route are cancelled until further notice.
My son and I have planned a trip today that included this run.
They really need to get the Nisqually on line so they have an extra vessel for this run.
Too many vessel breakdowns! Are you seeing whats going on Olympia? Get some more money to WSF!!!!
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Post by Barnacle on Mar 10, 2007 16:09:48 GMT -8
The money was allocated; the boats just don't jump right into service after being dead ship for four years. Be reasonable.
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Post by guest on Mar 10, 2007 16:40:31 GMT -8
Considering that the Klickitat has a crack in the hull plating spanning a watertight bulkhead, and that she has returned to service with a gale warning in effect; I'd say WSF needed another boat yesterday.
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Post by northwesterner on Mar 10, 2007 18:20:00 GMT -8
Too many vessel breakdowns! Are you seeing whats going on Olympia? Get some more money to WSF!!!! Money for what? 695 and its consequences played out 8 years ago. Funding has more or less been restored. Are you saying WSF needs more money for maintenance? Is WSF currently giving their fleet shoddy maintenance? Would more money for preventative maintenance prevented the "freak" problems that have sidelined Elwha and Tacoma this winter? I don't know. When most of the folks on this board complain at maintenace issues they point to the exterior paint. But lack of regular exterior painting is not effecting the ability of the fleet to operate. And the big maintenance and operational problems this winter have not been caused by lack of preventative maintenance, but instead by the loss of Elwha and Tacoma, reducing fleet wide flexibility. WSF is taking steps to increase fleet flexibility, starting with getting the Nisqually running again. But that takes time. My opinion is that this winter's drama has been caused by the perfect storm of loosing two large vessels for extended periods of time while trying to keep to the regular winter maintenace schedule. The S-Es still being required to do a hard day's work (see Klick at PT-K) is not a money issue - its a lawsuit issue, one that still isn't resolved. |
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Post by old_wsf_fan on Mar 11, 2007 17:55:29 GMT -8
Of course mechanical breakdowns are out of anyones control. I have not said that WSF is doing poor maintenence on their vessels.
What I meant in my rant is that in my opinion, every resource that you have available, should be used. In this case it is the Nisqually. Due to the age of these boats and the need for their daily use, she never should have been mothballed.
Sure it is a good idea to tighten the belt fiscally where and when you can, but since these boats are used on more than one route and they are 80 years old, an extra boat to swap out at various times makes the equipment last on all of the vessels.
Yes I know it takes time to increase the flexibility of the operation as a whole, but I can't help but think that the mothballing of the Nisqually was a budget cut decision as a result of I-695, (subsequant budgets with less operating capital).
Correct me if I am wrong. Yes it was 3 years after I-695 that she was laid up but more funding for general operations system wide is of a more recent occurence?
Don't you agree that an extra S-E would have made sense as that route has had its' share of lost sailings over the last few years?
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Post by brassman on Mar 11, 2007 18:28:38 GMT -8
One reason that the Nisqually was "chosen" to be laid up was that her GE drive motors suffered from the pulsed electrical power of its new propulsion system. The Quinault & Illahee have the much beefier Westinghouse drive motors, that can tolerate the pulsed power. The Klickitat has GE motors, but still has its original all DC propulsion system.
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Post by old_wsf_fan on Mar 11, 2007 19:13:22 GMT -8
Have the GE drive motors been changed out and exchanged for the Westinghouse variety during her refurbishment?
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Post by SS Shasta on Mar 11, 2007 21:46:40 GMT -8
One reason that the Nisqually was "chosen" to be laid up was that her GE drive motors suffered from the pulsed electrical power of its new propulsion system. The Quinault & Illahee have the much beefier Westinghouse drive motors, that can tolerate the pulsed power. The Klickitat has GE motors, but still has its original all DC propulsion system. It is interesting to note that MV Nisqually was the last Steel Electric to be modernized. One would think her equipment would be the most up-to-date in her class??? |
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Post by brassman on Mar 12, 2007 13:15:27 GMT -8
Don't think Westinghouse makes those drive motors anymore. The drive motors are the heart of the boat. To replace them would be the equilavent of a human heart transplant--major surgery, & not worth the money it would cost.
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Post by SS San Mateo on Mar 12, 2007 14:44:11 GMT -8
And the Klickitat is out of service again...
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Post by Barnacle on Mar 12, 2007 14:54:12 GMT -8
695 and its consequences played out 8 years ago. Funding has more or less been restored. Um, not really. Otherwise you'd have seen service restorations, even with the cost of fuel. Even with higher fares there's still a budget shortfall last I heard. |
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Post by SS San Mateo on Mar 12, 2007 15:09:50 GMT -8
And some of the service reductions occured 2-3 years ago:
No 3'rd vessel on weekends in the winter on Vashon/Southworth/Fauntleroy.
No San Juan interisland service on weekends in the winter.
No International Run service in the winter.
Further reduction of passenger-only service.
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Post by guest on Mar 12, 2007 15:54:02 GMT -8
Cracked hull. Coast Guard says no go.
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Post by Barnacle on Mar 12, 2007 20:27:07 GMT -8
Uh oh.
Anyone betting on long-term ramifications?
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Post by zman on Mar 12, 2007 22:16:47 GMT -8
I was wondering how this would work out...The word was on Sunday that she had something around a 17 inch crack. I was surprised to see that "repairs have been made". hmmmm
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Post by northwesterner on Mar 12, 2007 22:42:54 GMT -8
Uh oh. Anyone betting on long-term ramifications? It really is the perfect storm this winter... Sheesh. The question is - how long does WSF want to keep the route cancelled indefinately (as they are declaring it tonight in a web press release)? If they are willing to do some serious shuffling - could Evergreen go to Vashon, send Kitsap to the islands, and either Yakima or Kaleetan down to Kingston, freeing Quinault to go to Port Townsend-Keystone? How often do the Yakima and Kaleetan fill up in the islands in the winter? I can't think of any other possible scenario of vessel shuffling that wouldn't lead to severe capacity issues on the effected routes (for instance - Evergreen to Vashon, Spokane to Kingston, Kitsap to Bremerton, Quinault to Keystone would leave Bremerton with two Issaquahs, which is probably not enough capacity). The real key is that WSF needs to be able to do a swap such that one boat with enough capacity to handle the loads at Kingston can free up the Quinault to go to Keystone. |
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Post by hergfest on Mar 13, 2007 2:20:14 GMT -8
Hindsight is 20/20, but they should have waited to take the Walla Walla out of service until the Hyak comes back. This is a perfect storm for WSF. It brings into question the safety of all of the Steel Electrics and might bring the Coast Guard to put them all out of service. A 17" crack is nothing to laugh about. Now how does doing the Keystone survey three times and delaying the new class of boats numerous times look? I am betting the route won't start again until the Hyak comes back on the 20th, and that is assuming she is done on time. One other thought is they could run the route on weekends since the Illahee is just sitting at Friday Harbor.
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Post by Barnacle on Mar 13, 2007 5:18:57 GMT -8
How often do the Yakima and Kaleetan fill up in the islands in the winter? I can't think of any other possible scenario of vessel shuffling that wouldn't lead to severe capacity issues on the effected routes (for instance - Evergreen to Vashon, Spokane to Kingston, Kitsap to Bremerton, Quinault to Keystone would leave Bremerton with two Issaquahs, which is probably not enough capacity). The real key is that WSF needs to be able to do a swap such that one boat with enough capacity to handle the loads at Kingston can free up the Quinault to go to Keystone. Kaleetan/Yakima fill-up: 2500 passengers? Never. 150 cars? at least once a day. Full load of overheight traffic? 4-5 times. Before you say those are low numbers, consider how many sailings we get a day. And don't forget the viability of the Hiyu as a very temporary interisland boat. It's small, but it's scrappy. Perfect Storm? More like Tempest in a Teacup.  |
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Post by SS San Mateo on Mar 13, 2007 6:07:29 GMT -8
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Post by EGfleet on Mar 13, 2007 7:06:37 GMT -8
Eh, someone from Martinec probably posted that.  |
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Post by Barnacle on Mar 13, 2007 8:48:51 GMT -8
Probably. Martinac refuses to accept that not only does his bid not meet spec, it appears that his conceptual model won't fit the overhead walkways. I hear that their design has numerous other flaws as well.
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Post by northwesterner on Mar 13, 2007 9:53:39 GMT -8
Kaleetan/Yakima fill-up: 2500 passengers? Never. 150 cars? at least once a day. Full load of overheight traffic? 4-5 times. Before you say those are low numbers, consider how many sailings we get a day. And don't forget the viability of the Hiyu as a very temporary interisland boat. It's small, but it's scrappy. Thanks for the capacity information. That's what I wanted to know. I guess it really comes down to how many people WSF wants to inconvience and where they want to inconvience them. In order to free up the Quinault, some route (whether it be the Islands, Bremerton, or Kingston) is going to have to be downsized for a few weeks. I'm all for using the Hiyu as an interisland boat. But does she have a USCG Cert yet? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2007 12:35:10 GMT -8
It looks as though the Hiyu maybe going back into service! Down here at Eagle Harbor they are busy on her this morning. WSF seems to be doing lifeboat drills, moving trucks on and off of her and her props look like they are on too. Can anyone confirm that they are getting her ready for service? This is the most activity I have seen on her in years. Maybe she will go and replace teh Illahee and they will take her from the Islands to Port Townsend or send her to Kingston and the Quinault to Port Townsend?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2007 12:44:52 GMT -8
Ok the Hiyu just departed Eagel Harbor ship yard at 1:40pm. She is heading out of Eagle Harbor.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2007 14:03:04 GMT -8
Update the Hiyu came back into Eagle Harbor and is now departing the shipyard again @ 1455.
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