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Post by landlocked on Jun 21, 2008 11:01:03 GMT -8
Peter,
Thank you for your very kind words.
We at HL did work very hard and mourn its loss almost daily. Losing HL was akin to losing a child. I know that may sound extreme, but it is true. I was with a handful of HL people last night and they too continue to mourn, but of course, you move on.
Is there a successful formula for the Nanaimo route? I believe there is. It is a very complicated and risky venture. There are many stakeholders to satisfy including, most importantly, your potential clientel. In addition, you require a solid, bulletproof business plan with a Plan B and C and maybe even D. There are many pitfalls to overcome and surprisingly, most of them have some sort of Government or Government body attached to them! You have NO idea!
When someone asked my about Ed Lifes venture I would simply smile and say "He doesn't even know what he doesn't know" Let's leave it at that. What a surprise when I was one day reading the Nanaimo News Bulletin and Ed was quoted as saying "This business is all new to me. I don't even know what I don't know"
The BIGGEST challenge on a Nanaimo run will be gaining customer confidence. If someone like Jim Pattison or Dennis Washington had either one of their names on the product it would probably by a near instant success. Sorry Peter, but I'm afraid CLF have a long way to go before they could gain even a fraction of that sort of customer confidence.
Best Regards
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2008 17:10:51 GMT -8
I hear ya, Landlocked. Having a long way to go is the outcome of every journey when it starts. I don't understand why so many people warn us that it won't be easy...it won't. We know that. We're in it for the long haul. If I wanted easy, I'd have stayed where I was. Jim Pattison and Dennis Washington, being Billionaires, have their share of failures and difficulties in the past and only achieved success by moving forward when the naysayers said "you've got a long way to go". Their respective stories are inspirational. Actually, I kind of like Jim Clarke, of Silicon Graphics, Netscape, Healtheon fame. I like people who take the ups and downs and just move forward. People who never stop inventing, doing, trying. I don't change my favorite team when watching a football or hockey game and the other team scores first. I watch the entire game, and I root for teams that can adjust, think on their feet, and find a way to win. So you're right, we don't have Ed Pattison and Dennis Washington. We don't have Bill Belichek of the Patriots, or Joe Montana or Wayne Gretzky. And if Ed Life had Pattison and Washington on his team supporting HarbourLynx, would he have hired who he did, or would he have gone with someone different? Do you think that they would have hired players who could win?? No, HarbourLynx tried hard. It didn't work for whatever reason you choose to accept. And you don't know us. Watch the water. It's the only way anyone will believe, anyway. "Who dares, wins" Motto of the SAS
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Post by landlocked on Jun 22, 2008 6:23:19 GMT -8
Good Day Peter,
I'm not sure if I get a couple of your references. Where you say "if Ed Life had had them on his team would he have hired who he hired" Can you explain?
My reference to both Pattison or Washington is their financial capability and general standing in the community. If a recognized and accepted brand were to take on a Nanaimo run, they would gain far greater acceptance by their future clientel more quickly. When Ed came to town he did so with a "I know better" attitude. He didn't know better, nor did he have the resources to execute even the launch properly. In addition, he had other distractions, like a partner that didn't have the patience the first time around, why would he have the patience the second time.
Now, as far as my involvement, it was extremely easy for me to use 20/20 to critique what had gone wrong with HL prior to my joining the company. That's a given. I think that is what some of the commenters on the forum are trying to say. If a careful examination of the previous attempts had been made prior to your execution a lot could be learned. Ed Life met with a number of crew members of HL in what he called brainstorming sessions. Not once did he ever meet with any of the previous management, knowing full well where they were located and how they might help or be invaluable in their wisdom.
As far as BC Ferries is concerned, here is a company, both now and in its previous form, that has a most interesting view of the market. Any competitor both large and small is considered to be competition. They will do ANYTHING they can to squash it, and I mean 'like a bug'. Some of the stunts I have seen them pull are absolutely unbelievable. The sad part of it is that what they don't see is the possibility of market expansion. If a new player comes into their market it is entirely possible to grow market, not necessarily just be a competitor.
This is all very interesting discussion, where it will lead is yet to be determined. I will be watching from the sidelines with interest.
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Post by Ferry Rider on Jun 22, 2008 6:59:44 GMT -8
I am wondering,
I saw Landlocked’s description of BC Ferries, and that they will do anything to squash any perceived competition like a bug. And I think of what George Slade told me and see what he wrote about the BC Ferries report about his service.
Now I am thinking like those who think Elvis is still alive or JFK was shot by the CIA.
So my conspiracy theory is that maybe there was no real BC Ferries report. Maybe someone in BC Ferries created a fake report and then leaked it out to the reporter, making sure the reporter had enough information to contact George and scare him away.
So what do you think, Landlocked, is that something BC Ferries would or could do?
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Post by landlocked on Jun 22, 2008 8:07:34 GMT -8
I would believe the report to be real. BCFC explored many possible business markets. They chased Coast Ferries all over the coast until finally putting them out of business on the mid coast. Coast successfully sued them for that.
Look, you are talking about a publicly funded monopoly. With their public funding and their political connections they can do just about anything and they do! You have no idea!
BCFS considers any alternate service to be a competitor who will erode their numbers, and their model is so bad to start with. Take the major routes. Compare their available capacity with that of let's say Air Canada or WestJet. I bet you'll find its 75-80% utilization vs 15-20% for BCFS.
If you are used to working with 20, 30, 40% recapture of costs invested, you can execute a business plan to start a new service without it having to make money. Look at Translink. They were talking a few years ago about putting a run into Bowen Island on an experimental basis. Let's see, everyone on the Bowen run was being subsidized to the tune of $5.00 per pax, Translink had a bus service on the island that recovered about 15 cents of every dollar it cost to operate, and they were still thinking of starting a 1M test service for pax only to Vancouver. Huh?
The people in charge of BCFS are still civil servants, no matter how you cut it. They just think differently that a businessman. And they have the power of being able, if you resist and fight, of bringing action on you that you've never dreamt of. Just ask the fellow in Tsswwassen who operated the off site parking lot. He'll tell you the hell he went through when he crossed BCFS.
Capt George is right. If CLF is successful, I believe BCFS will have their own pax service to Vancouver within 5 years.
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Post by landlocked on Jun 22, 2008 9:27:01 GMT -8
Ferry Traveller, If you want to see what they are capable of, here's some reading. www.bcferrycommission.com/s69SeminarProceedings.pdfThis document is a list of the proceedings from a June, 2005 Alternate Service provision meeting held by Martin Crilly. Scroll down to Page 65-69 of the document. Interesting reading and a great history lesson to boot!
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Post by Ferryman on Jun 22, 2008 10:06:25 GMT -8
Thanks for posting that, Landlocked. I remember reading that report a while back, and was looking all over for it to post on here.
Thanks again.
-Chris
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Post by Ferry Rider on Jun 22, 2008 10:39:44 GMT -8
Wow, Wow and more Wow. Landlocked, You are right. What good reading. Coast Ferries experience with BC Ferries is amazing and holds exact parallels to what Captain George said was in the report. Not only is there the prospect of them competing someone who starts a new route out of business, they have already demonstrated they will and did do it. No conspiracy theory, more like fact. All I can say again is Wow.
I was the person who asked Captain George to join the forum. I saw him Friday night on the Queen of Surrey again. I am glad to see he posted his post. I wish he would participate as I feel he knows this route and service more than others as he has been there done that for longer than anyone else. His service outlasted Royal Sealink, Astolabe, and HarbourLynx. And even though he is no longer operating from the looks of it, his consulting business is just fine.
I see Guest 121 and Tempest keep asking, has Captain Shaker talked to those who have come before. I also see that Landlocked was with HarbourLynx. I also see that Landlocked said Captain Shaker was not interested in what he had to say. And from Captain George’s post Captain Shaker has never even talked to him. I also see from Peters posts they are talking to lots of people. Well who are they talking to if they are not talking to the people who have actually been there? It also seems they really need to talk to Bill New.
Wow interesting stuff.
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Post by landlocked on Jun 22, 2008 11:50:50 GMT -8
I told you it would be interesting reading!
If you look at the report Gibsons put out concerning passenger ferry service a few years ago, they talked about parking, transit and the like. Of note was the fact that BCFC would require somewhere in the order of a MINIMUM of 15% return on investment of any portion of their terminal usage. In other words they could spend what they wanted and charge the user whatever they spent, amortized over their prescribed amortization period and charge the operator based on a 15% return on that investment. Now, if they spent 100K on cash management the operator would be responsible for a percentage of that. Who would get all the parking fees? BCFS. Would they share that with the operator? NO. There was also the fact that the transit operator over there, presumably BC Transit had no appetite whatsoever to link up with a passenger only ferry.
I reviewed some of my calculations yesterday concerning fares. The way I have it figured, a person with a book of BCF tickets and a monthly commuter pass with Translink will get from Langdale to Downtown Vancouver for about $6.50 each way. Now, look at CLF at $24.00 return plus GST. That's about $13.00 each way. Now, don't get me wrong, because there are people who will pay it. But if you don't have the disposable income to fork out the extra $260/month to take CLF, you might be hooped and have to continue to take BCF. Don't forget, these calculations are only based on a customer working within WALKING distance of the Waterfront Station. If they have to buy a monthly transit pass in addition to the CLF fares, the difference between the two services becomes greater.
I don't know what the parking situation is like in Gibsons, but I don't believe it's good. So you resort to kiss and ride system. How many of the daily commuters can do that?
As far as Nanaimo was concerned, BCFS is ready to launch their service anytime they want. Push the button, plunk a float in the water and away they go. They will never do it as an additional offering which would in their eyes dilute their current pax count, but watch them do it if a passenger only operation becomes a success. In a heartbeat!
Scary, scary, stuff!
PS - Has anybody ever heard of the proposal to put two 300-400 pax high speed boats operating from Steveston to Sidney Inlet by CFI and Pacific Coach Lines? It was 1999.
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Post by landlocked on Jun 22, 2008 11:54:12 GMT -8
Chris,
You are very welcome. I remember it well. I was there. VERY interesting day!
Mr. New is a gentleman and I have spoken to him a number of times since.
I notice that, despite the fact that Martin Crilly facilitated that meeting, NOT ONE NEW service has been introduced under the ASP plan!
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Post by landlocked on Jun 22, 2008 12:56:21 GMT -8
I just wanted to clarify something. When I said "Capt Shaker did not seem to be interested in what I had to say", the operative word is SEEM. Having said that, please understand, that was my perception, certainly not something he said emphatically. Also, understand, I believe he is a very BUSY guy these days. I know what it is like to juggle as many balls in the air as I'm sure he is doing right now.
He knows where to contact me and if he feels the need to, I'm sure he will.
All I can say is good luck to the entire company. They will need it, not just under their current circumstances, but no more than any startup business does.
One thing I did notice Pete said, when he referred to the Coastal Runner's 'engine'. Did he mean one engine? Does she have one engine? Did I miss something, or do I have it right?
Regards
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2008 17:48:18 GMT -8
Hi All,
Great exchange, and Landlocked provided some very interesting perspective on this. When I first agreed to work with Ihab Shaker, a copy of the June 2005 Seminar Documentation was in the first courier pack I received. It's an interesting document and, as Landlocked said, the Bill New Coast Group pages make for compelling reading and some storm-cloud warnings.
There are many, many people involved in all aspects of past services. I think it would be a mistake to assume that we did not speak with, consult with and try to learn from a great many of them.
But then, all I've been saying is "look to the water". It's about the only thing I can say right now. Once Sea Trials are done, and we're in the water, it will be a different discussion. A fun week lays ahead for us!
See you all soon!!
Take care
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2008 18:07:20 GMT -8
Hey, two things I forgot... First, yes, one engine Landlocked. Sorry, i forgot to answer that. Secondly, does anyone remember a proposal/plan that involved the Sechelt Indian Band and Ferries, say 25-30 years ago? ? I toured a place and heard a story that told of a large-scale operational plan....if it was that big, some of you may have heard of it. Just wondering. Fun, wow!
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Post by tempest on Jun 22, 2008 20:16:02 GMT -8
Did I just read correctly??? One engine! You're kidding right? I hope you don't have to comply with the High Speed Craft code, because redundancy is everything.
One engine. I can't believe it.
Well, as you fellas have said all along "watch the water".
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Post by Guest 121 on Jun 22, 2008 20:24:31 GMT -8
I was having a beer this weekend with my ship yard buddy; I asked him how the Coastal Runner was going. Well these are his comments.
He feels it is three to four weeks away from getting into the water, lots of work still to go, then once in the water he figures about one week for Transport Canada to do all the Certification. So he figures we will see the boat about the beginning of August. If we are lucky....
Someone made a comment that he hopes CLF use reliable North American engines so I asked about the engines. My friend said there is only one engine and it had a funny name he never heard it before and could not remember, so it isn’t Cummins or Detroit etc. (My friend has been working at different ship yards for over 30 years, if it was a common North American name he would know it.) Then the other thing he told me was the engine came with the prop. According to him this is not a common approach either. So apparently the Prop tapper and shaft tapper were different. I can’t remember which but one was 12 degree tapper and the other was 10 degree. So they would not fit. So it seems that Captain Shaker, is not using a common North American engine or prop. Maybe he pulled the engine out of his old Hydrofoil, so maybe it is Russian. Good Luck with that one. Uh yes everyone, there is just one engine.
Now I am really wondering. I know these folks are convinced they have a real plan, but who would put one foreign engine in a commercial vessel, I guess Captain Ihab.
I also saw reference to a law suit between the Georgia Master and the Tourism Association, now folks that is my area so I took a look. Well sure enough there was a small claims action between Regent Navigation and The Sunshine Coast Tourism Association. Well it does not read well for the Tourism Association, they lost with basically no contest. Their basic defence was nothing. Their reply was completely dismissed by the Judge. Regent Navigation had a signed contract and there was no fault on the part of Regent Navigation, the Tourism Association just chose to not pay their bill. I looked further and there were others in line to take on the Tourism Association for not paying their other bills, like their landlord, but those did not proceed basically because after the first case, there was nothing else left.
I previously said tourism promises were not worth a dime, because there are certain industries which have reputations for not paying their bills, tourism is one of them. It would seem that generalization about tourism is not only a generalization but also a fact in this situation.
I would suggest Peter and Ihab take a close look at who they are talking to and dealing with on the Sunshine Coast side tourism/town of Gibsons/etc. I saw some common names listed in the documents in the filings with the court, and names currently in press reports. Leopards don’t change their spots, and it seems the same crowd, under a different label, are misleading Peter and Ihab. Due Diligence CLF do your Due Diligence.
Still with my lawyer hat on.
I looked at the Coastal Link Ferries web site, and I quote.
We are a new service operating in British Columbia featuring: • Commuter service between Vancouver and Gibsons in under an hour • Indian Arm Tours • Sunshine Coast Tour from Gibsons to Egmont • Camp charters to Keats, Gambier or Anvil Island • Lunch and dinner cruises • Dinner and Fireworks tours • Marine park tours Coastal Link Ferries operates the largest and fastest passenger-only vessel in the region.
I must protest. CLF is not operating; none of the services are currently operating. The Coastal Runner is not the largest passenger only ferry in the region, The Seabus is as far as I know. How can you be the fasted when you are not running, we don’t even know how fast the Coastal Runner will be, that won’t be known until the sea trials. In any case since the Coastal Runner is not moving at all a row boat is faster. Even when running I am sure many other passenger-only vessels are faster, I can think of many that do 36 plus, and the Coastal Runner is going to do what 20 – 22. Come on folks, the web site is pure misinformation at best.
I then have looked back at some press reports and statements quoted from Ihab and Peter.
In a report May 18 “Green said the 22-metre, 70-passenger vessel is close to completion at Sylte Shipyards in Vancouver. Sea trials will begin in two or three weeks, and the first sailing will be scheduled for mid-June.”
On May 26 in the Nanaimo Daily News Shaker is quoted “He said his experience with the Gibsons to Vancouver run, building a vessel on time on budget, indicates he can also deliver for a route between Nanaimo and Vancouver.”
Then on June 10 Peter said on this forum “I have to travel to Maple Ridge to get updated photos - I'm told it's in the Fraser River (upright).”
Sorry I need to say this, what %$#&@g experience with Gibsons to Vancouver. CLF is not operating; the vessel was not built on time. According to the May 18 report the vessel was to be doing sea trials about a week ago, and in service by today, but according to my friend it is still on dry land today with weeks of work still to go. Ihab has not delivered Gibsons to Vancouver and he is saying to Nanaimo look at what I did and that proves I can succeed in Nanaimo.
I really need to hold my tongue but Ihab is looking more and more like Maurice G. and Astrolabe the more I look into it. I since they have not talked to HL or GM I guess all this info is from Maurice G.
Well whatever it is not my money, and if George, and Landlocked are correct all we need to do is hope CLF runs for five years and BC Ferries will take it over.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2008 15:54:42 GMT -8
Ok Guest 121, you keep that Lawyer hat on. I, for one, appreciate the updates. I was just sharing your post with Ihab Shaker and got a few replies "straight from the Pharoah's mouth". First of all the engine is a DooSan. I hope I spelled that correctly. It's brand new. It was purchased with the engine/gearbox and propellor as one package, all new. Ihab shared that the reason for this is that whenever a vessel does not produce the required speeds, he and his colleagues find that the engine maker blames the prop maker, the prop maker blames the shaft maker, etc. So he purchased the assembly all new. Yeah, we used to own two of those Voshkod class Hydrofoils, I was nearly killed on one. Great for rivers. Ihab, by the way, was really appreciative of how you challenge based on your connections and information. Sure is refreshing from "you won't make it". Maybe we won't. Or maybe we will. Let's watch and see! But your posts are really great, so I wanted to thank you for what you share. Insofar as Tourism is concerned, I have a somewhat different approach, but your warnings about Sunshine Coast Tourism and the Town of Gibsons are well taken. Hence my different approach. The B&B association have an obvious interest in seeing us work, and like most any organization or operator once we're running we can put services in place and solidify relationships. All I can say about the Sunshine Coast B&B Association and about 30 other entities is that they would like to see it, see it work, and see how we can work together when it happens...that's fair. And you're also right, on several occasions I have given start dates, and I don't want to pass the buck. My information was premature, or wrong, or upside down. If it were my call, I just want to arrive with a boat and claim this land in the name of the King of England.....oh, right, that's been done. I'd rather just come with the vessel, we need to build the market anyway, might as well do it without the constant wondering when. And the other day, how many beers did your Shipyard friend have? I was told the ship was in the water a week or two ago, and then learned it wasn't. But tomorrow I'm en-route to the Shipyard because at 10am that will no longer be an issue. Again, that's what I was told....8:20 Ferry, camera, large bottle of Champagne....but 4 weeks until it's in the water? Not based on my information. But we'll see...I'll just watch the water, too. Ok, and the website. That's gonna change, but let's talk business here gang. I didn't put that website in place...if I could set fire to it, I would. This morning I met with a contact who is helping me revamp it, and I'll be sending the new copy and layout to our designer at the end of this week. I say "lets talk business" because I didn't want to keep paying to have changes done piece-by-piece when I can get it done in one fell swoop. I wish I could invite you all to come bash the old site with a hammer or something. A nice attempt, but not the professional image and we do make some inaccurate claims. Guest 121, I owe you a beer or two. As long as it's not on billable time... But I do appreciate your input here, you put a lot of time and effort into this. Believe me, I'm listening. Take care all
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Post by Neil on Jun 23, 2008 16:55:38 GMT -8
This continues to be one of the most interesting, informative threads we've had on this forum. My only complaint is with George Slade's assertion, that those of us who don't 'have a dime on the line' have no right to criticize or be skeptical. Sorry, George, but those of us who've followed shipping on the coast for years, and have had our fill of misguided or under financed entrepreneurs, have every right to be skeptical. This is our forum, after all.
But it's been great getting input from the people who have been, or are now, involved in ferry ventures on the coast. I reserve the right to be skeptical, but I think a lot of us really appreciate Peter Green's willingness to share with us the vision and preparations for CLF's launch, and I sincerely hope we're witnessing the birth of a successful addition to our coastal passenger transportation network, lacking in players as it now is.
One question: what actual market research was done before this venture was decided on, in terms of hard potential passenger counts and business costs? Why did Capt. Shaker settle on this route, as opposed to other areas?
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Post by Guest 121 on Jun 23, 2008 21:56:22 GMT -8
Peter
Save your beer money on me, I don't know dick about running a ferry service, I just know Due Diligence. Anyone can do that if they try. (I don't see you trying)
I think your beer money should be spent taking Landlocked, Kona Winds and George Slade, and pick their brains.
And finally keep your beer money away from the Town folk, they will steel it, feed you a pack of mis information, take your money, and laugh as you sink. They did it to Maurice G, they will do it to you.
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Post by Guest 101 on Jun 24, 2008 7:43:08 GMT -8
Peter,
I guess you have been busy - any chance to see a few pictures of this vessel - single engine or not?
Is she a mono-hull or Catamaran? With one engine if correct, then I would think - logically be a mono-hull.
Steel or Aluminum ?
Thanks,
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Post by Northern Exploration on Jun 24, 2008 7:55:27 GMT -8
Peter you have a PM. Thanks.
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Post by Canadian Documentary on Jun 24, 2008 10:18:22 GMT -8
I think with some careful planning you could do very well bringing in people from the city to the coast or counterwise. My concern for you is problems beyond the sailing. I've noticed many postings regarding BC Ferries and competition, judging by those comments a drive by night company would be the ideal for making a chunk of money then pealing out. That or endure the wrath of public funded competition. Another problem is parking and transit on the coast. For "Coasters" going to Vancouver they need a place to park they're car, ideally for free. For "Vancouverites" to come to the coast they need transit or efficient transportation. Because besides walking dowtown Gibsons they'll want to go around, maybe bike rentals nearby or something. If there's nothing for the tourist when they get off your boat you lose them. They will go on the ferry and enjoy their burger, look in the boutique drink a beer on the outer deck and have a bus waiting for them at the footpassenger exit. A 50 minute sailing goes very fast with a burger and a beer.
As for commuters there's some money to be made. But that comes down to timing and routine. All commuters deal with the "Queen of Surrey" they have they're routine and down well, maybe it's an incovienance but why break routine for uncertainty. They know that by using the ferry service they are contributing to an essential service for coastal living and that any changes in that service are drastic, such as late sailings, change in prices etc... 1 advantage you could get with commuters is have a later sailing than the ferries, return from hockey game or go to Vancouver for night life.
I agree when the boat is there we will take it. But if the boat is there and the experience sucks we are gone and the best advertisement is word to mouth.
I think depending on advertising and the dock in Vancouver. You could have full rides all weekends. Lots of people come into the Coast.
As a finisher I'm a loyal BC Ferries rider I've had my car boosted and my doors unlocked I've even had my old beater pushed of the boat by the staff, and i enjoy my breakfast on the boat while i'm going to Vancouver. But that being said i would really enjoy the convienance of going straight to downtown Vancouver, And for that reason alone you can count on me to occasionally ride your boat.
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Post by landlocked on Jun 24, 2008 21:40:14 GMT -8
Well gents...I'm now officially a member. Go figure!
This thread just keeps getting better and better!
The more I read and the more I find out, the more fearful I become of this project. I seem to be hearing a lot of "we're exploring this or that, and I've said to myself "why wasn't that base covered?"
I understand from a friend in Maple Ridge who has been down to see the boat a number of times, he explains that you can't build a less expensive boat. Apparently it is as plain jane as you get. I am concerned about the single engine aspect mind you. When everyone else seems to be looking at redundancy in scheduled carriers, here's a fellow that goes the other way. I was always of the believe that a new HarbourLynx would have four engines, not two. Instead, this adventurer named Capt Shaker is going the other way and going down to one engine. Very brave move.
Of all the things that have been done here I will give both Ihab and Peter kudos for having balls. We can certainly all sit here and criticize and claim they will fail BUT I am also a believer in the fact that only those that watchers never fail, only doers.
I look forward to seeing pictures of the little rascal sitting in th water.
Regards
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2008 21:53:45 GMT -8
Just a wierd question....I was on the Queen of Surrey on the 7:20 departure (was it 7:20?) to Langdale. I had my daughter with me. A gent in a white t-shirt was sitting at one of the computer workstations and I thought I glanced and saw this forum on this laptop. Argh! I crossed at the 4:30 sailing and expected to pick my wife up from the Airport Shuttle (Seattle Airport) and her flight was 3 hours late. you can't catch a ferry! Well, that's going to change, if only for my wife's infrequent trips to New York to visit family! Believe it or not, the Coastal Runner is in the Water. Yup! Photos will be up tomorrow. I PROMISE, no takebacks. Our Crew arrives - I had to arrange their hotels and stuff - to Sea Trial the Vessel and then bring her over to menace the Sunshine Coast! Mono-hull by the way. Wait until I announce the open house, you can come and kick the tires. What else? Oh, and Guest 121 is right, there are a lot of people to learn from. Let me share this, I counted my date-book the other day, I was doing my mileage report and I have met with a great many people. 77 in all. Including those involved in past ventures, but I'm getting my drink-buyin' purse and will see if i can't learn more from those that Guest 121 suggested. As Neil said, this is OUR forum. We are welcomed to be skeptical, etc. I only have one request - it's ok if you are skeptical, doubtful, poke holes in what you think is our plan, assume we didn't conduct any "real" research, etc. You are welcomed and encouraged to feel exactly how you feel. Just as we are free to do business as we see fit. We love a good fight, and we know it's going to take a long-term campaign to make this work. Like I said...would I have come 3000 miles if I wanted it to be easy? That wouldn't be worth it. But there are villains, people out to pick our pockets, people who fear our succes more than our failure, organizations that will go to great lengths to crush us, some who won't like our product....so if they're going to play the big boy's games, they better be prepared to play by the big boys rules!!!! And finally, I now have over 140 emails of support for our Commuter Service - mostly from Commuters or would-be commuters. I have three angry letters, one of which didn't add a name or signature so it's tossed. The other two I responded to. Our waiting list is growing, and they are asking when we will be operational. There are those who doubt, and those who shout, and those who hang about......there are enough people for the Queen of Surrey to serve breakfast and be the big cozy loveboat of the Sound, and for the little Coastal Runner to people into the big city. There's room for both of us! I enjoy this forum. I really do, and it teaches and sharpens me. Thank you all!
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Post by Guest 121 on Jun 25, 2008 6:09:17 GMT -8
What else? Oh, and Guest 121 is right, there are a lot of people to learn from. Let me share this, I counted my date-book the other day, I was doing my mileage report and I have met with a great many people. 77 in all. Including those involved in past ventures, but I'm getting my drink-buyin' purse and will see if i can't learn more from those that Guest 121 suggested. And finally, I now have over 140 emails of support for our Commuter Service - mostly from Commuters or would-be commuters. I have three angry letters, one of which didn't add a name or signature so it's tossed. The other two I responded to. Our waiting list is growing, and they are asking when we will be operational. Peter I don't find it hard to believe you found 77 people who were willing to give you free advice, but I question if they are the right people. I don't think there are 77 people who know this route or business well enough. I have been hammering you on have you talked to the right people because the news reports and the posts do not inspire confidence. On the other hand you are right it is your business and you can do as you please, and Niel is also right we can comment all we please. I think the reason so many are commenting and so interested is we really do want you to succeed, and the comments are intended to be constructive. I think there is no question the commuters will be on the Coastal Runner, some sooner some later but for sure the first sailing will be full within 3 months, that is what happened with the Georgia Master. For me it is all the rest that I am not so sure about. I think the only people who do know for sure are those who have come before. But this is where I scratch my head. It does not seem that the research has been with the right people, those who know the best those who have done this before. That list is not long, but it is specific. After reading the link that Landlocked provided I would add to the list Bill New. Also there is Graham Clarke from Harbour Ferries. (Gee I feel like I am cross examining peter, but I am not getting the specifics I am looking for.) I am not interested in the number of politicians you talked to or the deck hand on HarbourLynx, who in management in any relevant past operation have you talked to, what is their name? Seems simple to me, if you have talked to anyone in that role. Can you tell us that.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2008 9:05:32 GMT -8
In reference to who we talked to....no, I can't disclose those from past services, nor a lot of the contacts we have made. If you write to me personally I might discuss it further, guest 121, but here on this forum I notice there are a lot of eyes. Certain information gets back to me in other ways, and things said here indicate that there are some information feeds who I am not comfortable with knowing our business. I'm sure you'll understand. As I said previously, there are a lot of things I can't share. For instance, you mentioned that you're not interested in "the number of politicans you (we) talked to or the deckhand on the Harbourlynx...". I can assure you we speak to relatively few politicians, and it was definitely not a deckhand or mate or carpet cleaner who visited the company offices weekly. Actually, everyone has a perspective, so a deck hand might be interesting. From past I experience I know that they often overhear conversations and can be tuned to customer satisfaction issue. And here, under cross-examination, I exercise my right to the 5th Amendment.....wait a minute, this is Canada! Right, but I'm American, too. And your shipyard friend told you this past weekend that the vessel was 4 weeks from the water, yet it's in the water now. (Photos are coming, Ihab actually took them!!! He's emailing them today, I'll have them up). And I just had to amend a few rooms for our crew this week....and am fielding communications with other sources, so I guess that shipyard friend is right? I wonder about your sources, too, but I don't have the right to call you to the stand! heh heh, just kidding around....but I'm dead serious, I would not discuss my contacts here. My father was a signal corps officer here at the old listening station, back in the Cold War days. He was stationed in BC for a decade. He gave me a wonderful suggestion about feeding false information to find the leak...I found two. One day I'll share it, but for now, this is why I am very careful about what I disclose. Here's the facts: The vessel is (finally) in the water. Our crew are coming this week to conduct sea trials. I'm with you all, I'm hopeful it goes smoothly. We want it to succeed too. As I said, we do it a little differently. And maybe it has to be done differently in order to work? Watch for photos.
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