Original names of the Spirits

[Alec]

So we all know the name of the two Spirits, but I came across something that intrigued me today. I occasionally read through court and other quasi-judicial tribunal rulings, and found Order No. 288-1999 of the Information and Privacy Commissioner for British Columbia.

The order itself is not particularly important for the purposes of my question, but at para. 6, the two vessels that we now know as the Spirits were referred to as the Queen of Vancouver Island and Queen of British Columbia. This can't be a mistake or a misinformed adjudicator, because in the same sentence, it is clarified that the vessels were later renamed to their current names.

Does anybody know anything more about this? I wasn't able to find anything online about it. I'm sort of curious to know why BC Ferries transitioned away from the Queen of naming system in the first place, and I believe the Spirits were the first to ditch that naming convention in '93 and '94.

TYIA

[WettCoast]

Looks like that document dates from 1999 and is simply mistaken about the names. They never had the ‘Queen’ moniker at any time, though they were unofficially dubbed as the ‘Queens of Lego’ during their construction.

[Neil]

Aug 2, 2023 17:15:46 GMT -8 WettCoast said:

Looks like that document dates from 1999 and is simply mistaken about the names. They never had the ‘Queen’ moniker at any time, though they were unofficially dubbed as the ‘Queens of Lego’ during their construction.

But, Jim, I wonder if during the planning phase they actually were supposed to have the 'Queen' moniker, only to be changed by launch date. Skeena Queen was launched in 1997, the last with the imperial name. Maybe that was up for debate several years earlier when the two boats were being considered and tendered?

[Alec]

Aug 2, 2023 20:25:33 GMT -8 Neil said:

Aug 2, 2023 17:15:46 GMT -8 WettCoast said:

Looks like that document dates from 1999 and is simply mistaken about the names. They never had the ‘Queen’ moniker at any time, though they were unofficially dubbed as the ‘Queens of Lego’ during their construction.

But, Jim, I wonder if during the planning phase they actually were supposed to have the 'Queen' moniker, only to be changed by launch date. Skeena Queen was launched in 1997, the last with the imperial name. Maybe that was up for debate several years earlier when the two boats were being considered and tendered?

This is what I was thinking. Obviously neither of the ships ever went into service with the Queen names, so they must have been changed before they were launched, or before they were laid down at all. The document is indeed dated 1999, but it is in relation to the construction of the two ships, so the adjudicator would be privy to internal information that perhaps the general public at the time wasn't, and that may include the originally proposed names for the two ships.

Was just curious if anyone else had heard anything about this before.

[WettCoast]

Aug 2, 2023 20:25:33 GMT -8 Neil said:

Aug 2, 2023 17:15:46 GMT -8 WettCoast said:

Looks like that document dates from 1999 and is simply mistaken about the names. They never had the ‘Queen’ moniker at any time, though they were unofficially dubbed as the ‘Queens of Lego’ during their construction.

But, Jim, I wonder if during the planning phase they actually were supposed to have the 'Queen' moniker, only to be changed by launch date. Skeena Queen was launched in 1997, the last with the imperial name. Maybe that was up for debate several years earlier when the two boats were being considered and tendered?

I have never heard any talk or seen any documentation that BCF was originally considering “Queen” prefixes. While they may have considered such it certainly never got to any official state so ‘renaming’ them as ‘Spirits’ never took place because they never had any other ‘official’ name.

[Dane]

The Spirits construction was heavily subsidized by the "Spirit BC" labour/education program which started in 91 from the first NDP budget. Spirit of British Columbia is a politically 'influenced' name, and appears as early as '92 in BC Ferries materials. I'm confident there was never an intent to be "Queen of British Columbia".

[QoNW Fan]

You know, Queen of British Columbia and Queen of Vancouver Island both have a nice ring to them. I suppose Queen of Vancouver Island would have caused confusion with the Queen of Vancouver already in service. Maybe that's why I like the name! 

[markkarj]

Aug 7, 2023 12:46:36 GMT -8 Dane said:

The Spirits construction was heavily subsidized by the "Spirit BC" labour/education program which started in 91 from the first NDP budget. Spirit of British Columbia is a politically 'influenced' name, and appears as early as '92 in BC Ferries materials. I'm confident there was never an intent to be "Queen of British Columbia".

I thought the BC Spirit campaign was a Social Credit initiative. The NDP wouldn't have had a budget in 1991 because 1) they came to power after a mid October election, so they would have barely had four and a bit months left in the fiscal year to actually table one, and 2) I'm pretty sure the first sitting of the legislature didn't happen until 1992 when they would have tabled that first budget.

I'm trying to find the 1992 budget to see what was said in those documents. I did find the 1994 budget (Elizabeth Cull was minister at that point), which was more referring to the BC21 infrastructure program (of which I think the fast cats were part, but announced a little later that year).

[Dane]

Aug 7, 2023 17:07:45 GMT -8 markkarj said:

Aug 7, 2023 12:46:36 GMT -8 Dane said:

The Spirits construction was heavily subsidized by the "Spirit BC" labour/education program which started in 91 from the first NDP budget. Spirit of British Columbia is a politically 'influenced' name, and appears as early as '92 in BC Ferries materials. I'm confident there was never an intent to be "Queen of British Columbia".

I thought the BC Spirit campaign was a Social Credit initiative. The NDP wouldn't have had a budget in 1991 because 1) they came to power after a mid October election, so they would have barely had four and a bit months left in the fiscal year to actually table one, and 2) I'm pretty sure the first sitting of the legislature didn't happen until 1992 when they would have tabled that first budget.

I'm trying to find the 1992 budget to see what was said in those documents. I did find the 1994 budget (Elizabeth Cull was minister at that point), which was more referring to the BC21 infrastructure program (of which I think the fast cats were part, but announced a little later that year).

The 1991 budget was Spirit BC so I have the NDP part wrong, then. The early 1992 sitting would make sense. The program must have been a carry-over (or just not cancelled yet? Insert appropriate end here). Im trying to remember when the Spirit order started, 1990? 89? (Dane in the future here after looking at my old notes, it was September 9,1990. And the project was referred to as the BC Spirit Ferry. Totally Social Credit. April 1992 is the earliest reference I can find to the actual ship name, but that doesn't in itself mean anything)

Edit to add - I forgot all about the BC21 time. I was actually reasonable aware of the world by that point and that logo was all over the place!

[dave2]

Aug 7, 2023 17:07:45 GMT -8 markkarj said:

Aug 7, 2023 12:46:36 GMT -8 Dane said:

The Spirits construction was heavily subsidized by the "Spirit BC" labour/education program which started in 91 from the first NDP budget. Spirit of British Columbia is a politically 'influenced' name, and appears as early as '92 in BC Ferries materials. I'm confident there was never an intent to be "Queen of British Columbia".

I thought the BC Spirit campaign was a Social Credit initiative. The NDP wouldn't have had a budget in 1991 because 1) they came to power after a mid October election, so they would have barely had four and a bit months left in the fiscal year to actually table one, and 2) I'm pretty sure the first sitting of the legislature didn't happen until 1992 when they would have tabled that first budget.

I'm trying to find the 1992 budget to see what was said in those documents. I did find the 1994 budget (Elizabeth Cull was minister at that point), which was more referring to the BC21 infrastructure program (of which I think the fast cats were part, but announced a little later that year).

The earliest mention in my archives of what would become the Spirit Of British Columbia is this newspaper clipping from February 15 1991. Bill Vander Zalm was still Premier, but would be gone ~6 weeks later.