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Post by Low Light Mike on May 16, 2011 9:54:08 GMT -8
I stopped by my favourite Nanaimo bookshop again today. While there, I picked up Captain Birkeland's book "Echoes of Puget Sound".
It's a 1960 hardcover 1st edition. It's a welcome addition to my library.
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Mill Bay
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Post by Mill Bay on May 16, 2011 15:12:27 GMT -8
The store still has the $125 copy of BC Rail (the line called BC Rail....) history. I'm not sure of the title, but it's hardcover and has lots of nice photos. - I'm not knowledgeable enough (or interested enough) in the BC Rail Line to get value of this book. yet.... If anyone else finds another copy of this book PLEASE let me know Ive been looking for one for a while. The proper title is "British Columbia Railway: From PGE to BC Rail". Cheers, Oh, forgot he was a train nut, too. Anyway: I have a copy, but do not plan on selling it. Sorry . My advice would be, wait until the annual model railway show in Chilliwack and then check all the vendors. There's usually at least one copy floating around there. Or, since it is a railways specific book: check Central Hobbies in Vancouver for a copy.
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Mill Bay
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Post by Mill Bay on May 16, 2011 15:14:51 GMT -8
I stopped by my favourite Nanaimo bookshop again today. While there, I picked up Captain Birkeland's book "Echoes of Puget Sound". It's a 1960 hardcover 1st edition. It's a welcome addition to my library. ---------------- I'm telling you Flugel: just work a deal and buy that bookstore.
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Post by Low Light Mike on May 16, 2011 15:26:02 GMT -8
If anyone else finds another copy of this book PLEASE let me know Ive been looking for one for a while. The proper title is "British Columbia Railway: From PGE to BC Rail". Cheers, Oh, forgot he was a train nut, too. Anyway: I have a copy, but do not plan on selling it. Sorry . My advice would be, wait until the annual model railway show in Chilliwack and then check all the vendors. There's usually at least one copy floating around there. Or, since it is a railways specific book: check Central Hobbies in Vancouver for a copy. I have a copy in my backpack right now. haha
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Post by Dane on May 16, 2011 15:29:08 GMT -8
I have had a lot of luck with that BC Rail book South of the border at Washington train shows, too. A lot of interest in BC Rail down there, however items do not retain their value as high as it is in BC. Just a thought if you're ever in that neck of the woods. Scored it for $40 at Shaver in Victoria several years ago. Think one of the non-Train guys priced it before it was picked up by another employee...!
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Post by WettCoast on May 16, 2011 17:55:59 GMT -8
Looking to pick up ferry/ship or railway books cheap, like say $1 per volume?
You should try the Mr. DOT method. The trick is attending a lot of garage sales. There you will find people parting with books for next to nothing. Most of the time the sellers have no clue as to what a book might actually be worth. They just want to get rid of them. Your best bet is 'estate' sales.
I do not know if my brother has a copy of the BC Rail book that we have been discussing, but if he does he likely picked it up for under $10, maybe even for one loonie!
A word of warning though - it might be only one in 10 or 20 garage sales that have good books available for next to nothing. But then what else is there to do on a Saturday morning.
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mrdot
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Post by mrdot on May 16, 2011 18:20:22 GMT -8
:)my brother is rite, fudge horn, and others have been posting books that are similar in cost to what some of my ship society frends and others have paid out 50-75$ and more, and I have spotted the same book for 2 bits sometimes. my ships locker would blow many of your minds, as it has my brother, almost all of the books shown in the latest finds are in this bunker! so the day is coming when some younger ship nut will have to tend to this rather large collection of stuff, I can still hear my wife's father reminding me that there will be no U- hauls accompaning me to my maker! there are some titles that I have paid full price as well! :)mrdot.
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Post by Low Light Mike on May 16, 2011 18:30:47 GMT -8
Here's the "about the author" page from the 1960 book "Echoes of Puget Sound." - author is Capt. Torger Birkeland. ....I like the part in the final paragraph about the E-State's place of fame.
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mrdot
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Post by mrdot on May 16, 2011 18:35:06 GMT -8
:)continuing of this subject, the BC rail book, or one of them was in the free box, as the lady running the garage sale was just wanting to get rid of anything that reminded her of her ex, a messy parting of the ways I guess, and some of the estate sales are run by younger generation family that have no sence of the value these items may have been, to the departed. :'(mrdot.
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Post by Mike on Jun 3, 2011 16:30:31 GMT -8
Added three more books to my collection today.
- Coasters by Rob Morris - Pacific Coastal Liners by Gordon Newell & Joe Williamson - The Princess Story by Norman R. Hacking & W. Kaye Lamb
I also couldn't resist buying another softcover copy of The Ships of British Columbia. It was in near mint condition and only $10.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jun 11, 2011 14:07:35 GMT -8
Here's a book that we borrowed from our library. - part of the title is obscured by the library sticker: the boat's name is "Sam". Mrs. Horn has a thing for pickle boats, and so she was curious to borrow this book. - here's a 1-page teaser.
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FNS
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The Empire Builder train of yesteryear in HO scale
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Post by FNS on Jun 11, 2011 17:17:32 GMT -8
Those are neat little boats.
We had a family vacation in San Diego back in the 1980s or 1990s and we stayed at the Catamaran.
My sister and I took one of these boats from there to Sea World one day. Very cute. I got to take the helm on the way back. Very fun to steer. Rather slow, but who's in a hurry when on a vacation?!
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Post by WettCoast on Jul 4, 2011 20:00:34 GMT -8
Note for anyone interested in obtaining copies in good to excellent condition and at reasonable prices of various BC Ferry and other west coast marine related books....
There is a book store on Oak Bay Avenue*, Victoria, called Grafton Book Shop which has a number of sought after titles, including the Bannerman Book. My brother was in there early today, and he was fairly impressed. There are Robert Turner & Joe Williamson titles, as well as at least one 'Janes' title. Check it out.
* 2238 Oak Bay Ave, Oak Bay
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Post by Scott on Jul 11, 2011 6:34:36 GMT -8
I just heard on the news this morning that Gary Bannerman passed away at the age of 64. He's the author of the "Bannerman book" we all refer to: the best? compilation of BC Ferries history and stories and photos in printed form - probably a book that got a lot of us hooked on following the ferries. www.cknw.com/Channels/Reg/NewsLocal/Story.aspx?ID=1455196
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Neil
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Post by Neil on Jul 11, 2011 10:52:38 GMT -8
Keep in mind that the Bannerman book was a BC Ferries publication; Bannerman was commmissioned to write it. It is not a legitimate history of BC ferries- such a book is still waiting to be written.
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mrdot
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Post by mrdot on Jul 11, 2011 11:51:10 GMT -8
:)yes, my copy inscribed by Gary Bannerman is simply written to "my frend" same as mr Bennett used to do, so I guess I will need to send my farewell, and condolences to his widow Patrica! mrdot.
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Mill Bay
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Post by Mill Bay on Jul 11, 2011 12:58:09 GMT -8
64 seems quite young an age to pass on these days, although it sounds like he had a full life.
I'm confused by the issue of what a legitimate historical document is, though, and that's after I would make the remark that, with the author now passed on and not able to take up his own stance any longer, that particular political horse should also be put out to pasture, and we should not speak ill of the dead. If it was a commissioned work of the ferry corporation, then in that sense, it can be considered a primary historical document because it is tied directly to the company and was not produced as an outside documentary piece.
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Neil
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Post by Neil on Jul 11, 2011 13:42:36 GMT -8
I guess I have a different view of what constitutes a legitimate work of history than do Mill Bay and Mr Keenlyside.
I don't know how on earth a commissioned book could be considered an unbiased, warts and all look at any company. No person in their right mind would regard a book about Exxon, paid for and published by that company, to be anything but a publicity piece in their favor, so why do we ascribe more value to Gary Bannerman's book? Does anyone think that a book, which shows the author sharing a bottle with the person who hired him to write about BC Ferries, is going to give an unbiased appraisal of that fellow's tenure as head honcho? How can an in house publication be a 'primary historical document'?
As for Paul's comment about political rhetoric, there are comments in Bannerman's book about NDP 'chaos' and the allegation that they sold out to the union, as well as other remarks which express clear indications of political preference, but Paul wouldn't regard that as rhetoric, probably because he agrees with it. Perceptions of rhetoric are always very subjective to one's own biases, which I for one am willing to admit.
'Dogwood Fleet' was also written for BC Ferries. I've enjoyed both books, and my comments have nothing to do with "speaking ill of the dead", as Mill Bay curiously suggests. I just think that ferry fans perhaps set the bar a bit low when it comes to crediting actual journalism.
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Post by Scott on Jul 11, 2011 16:28:36 GMT -8
I wonder if it would ever be worthwhile for anyone to try and write an unbiased history of BC Ferries and publish it as a book. And not that any piece of work is completely objective... you might need several authors in order to achieve any sense of an unbiased perspective. Having a company comission a book of that sort is probably the only thing that would make it worthwhile financially for someone to do it.
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Mill Bay
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Post by Mill Bay on Jul 11, 2011 16:42:44 GMT -8
I find it funny the same comment is always made every time we mention the title of that book. But, I think I defined what I meant in my actual post to begin with... try reading past the bias!
It can be considered a primary historical document because it is tied directly to the company and was not produced as an outside documentary piece.
It is a primary source of information because of its having been produced by the subject of reference. Individuals`journals and diaries are considered primary documents; minutes of meetings and societies are primary documents and you can`t get much more biased in such instances. Consider it the personal diary of the BC Ferries corporation, and then you can find it to be historical. The so called warts and political rhetoric are inclusive to the context the book was written in, and most definitely seem to provide some people with something to analyze. Ergo: that type of analysis is what you do to a primary source when examining it and critiquing it in a secondary review.
The clinical, annotated, peer reviewed scholarly journal piece you are looking for would necessarily be considered a secondary source of information because it is coming from the stance of looking in from the outside and examining the content -- the whole content -- of the source and appraising it as a whole. Not just the jabs at the NDP or the gloats of Social Credit. You can make note of those if you want, but you need to remember that they simply may be the backdrop of the piece. But if all you are focusing on in the entire book is that, then why don`t we just burn it now and be done with it
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Post by WettCoast on Jul 11, 2011 17:31:45 GMT -8
It is indeed sad to here of the early passing of Gary Bannerman. His book, The Ships of British Columbia, is something every BC Ferry fan should have in their collection*. It is a good read, has many excellent photos, and even features some of my brother, Mr. DOT's, artwork.
Having said all of that it falls far short of the quality and depth found in the Robert Turner books on CPR marine and rail history in BC. In fact, the Bannerman book is not in the same league at all. The definitive history of BC Ferries is yet to be written.
*Even though The Ships of British Columbia may not ever have been a 'definitive history', it is recommended by me to all the younger members of this forum (especially those on the Canadian side of the 49th parallel). If you are looking for a copy I do know that some are available in book stores such as the one that I posted about last week. My brother also has some surplus copies that may be available to younger BC ferry fans. If you are interested send me a 'PM'.
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Neil
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Post by Neil on Jul 11, 2011 21:32:56 GMT -8
I find it funny the same comment is always made every time we mention the title of that book. But, I think I defined what I meant in my actual post to begin with... try reading past the bias! It can be considered a primary historical document because it is tied directly to the company and was not produced as an outside documentary piece. It is a primary source of information because of its having been produced by the subject of reference. Individuals`journals and diaries are considered primary documents; minutes of meetings and societies are primary documents and you can`t get much more biased in such instances. Consider it the personal diary of the BC Ferries corporation, and then you can find it to be historical. The so called warts and political rhetoric are inclusive to the context the book was written in, and most definitely seem to provide some people with something to analyze. Ergo: that type of analysis is what you do to a primary source when examining it and critiquing it in a secondary review. The clinical, annotated, peer reviewed scholarly journal piece you are looking for would necessarily be considered a secondary source of information because it is coming from the stance of looking in from the outside and examining the content -- the whole content -- of the source and appraising it as a whole. Not just the jabs at the NDP or the gloats of Social Credit. You can make note of those if you want, but you need to remember that they simply may be the backdrop of the piece. But if all you are focusing on in the entire book is that, then why don`t we just burn it now and be done with it I don't think that a commissioned, promotional work should be regarded as a 'primary source' of information. There is too much ommission, and too much focus on presenting the information in a certain light. No one is talking about burning the book; it should be enjoyed for what it is, and not held up as any definitive chronicle of BC Ferries, because it is not. Dependable, insightful histories of anything cannot be funded by their subjects, especially when the subject is as controversial as BC Ferries has from time to time been. John's question about who might be qualified to write an even handed history of BC Ferries is a good one, especially given the politically polarized climate we live in. I don't know enough about historical writers who are currently active in BC. Among journalists, I might trust the Globe's Rod Mickleburgh, or the Sun's Stephen Hume.
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Post by Curtis on Jul 11, 2011 22:15:06 GMT -8
It is Sad to hear of his passing. The Bannerman Book is one of the only Ferry Books I am in possession of. I found it 6 Years ago at that Saltspring Book Shop that has come up here before. Provided many hours of reading and plenty of good Ferries Shots to look at. Perhaps I should pull it out again in the not too distant future.
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mrdot
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Post by mrdot on Jul 12, 2011 20:24:02 GMT -8
:)you know it would be nice if we could wipe out any political monkey buisness from the BC ferry history, but that would be missing alot of the story, so that would mean leaving any died in the wool political pundents from both left and rite, on the dock, and finding a truly unbiased scolarly individual to write this very difficult work, someone like the late W. K. Lamb, or someone of like neutrality! I fear that cancels out alot of the passengers in my life's journey!:)mrdot.
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Neil
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Post by Neil on Jul 12, 2011 20:35:18 GMT -8
Interesting observations. A primary historical document is one that orginates from resources of the subject. In other words, a primary document about the history of Dave Barrett's time in office written by the NDP would be primary (as in a tribute book they gave out during the c. 1985 leadership), or a biography written in consulation with the subject. The same can be said to a collection of pages written about Social Credit by that party. In regards to Dogwood Fleet and Queens of B.C. both would be regarded as primary documents. Both are historical narratives. Neither are journalistic products in such as jouralism would appear in a newspaper. And Neil never assume or make presumptions. I never indicated as you stated: " Bannerman's book about NDP 'chaos' and the allegation that they sold out to the union, as well as other remarks which express clear indications of political preference Paul wouldn't regard that as rhetoric, probably because he agrees with agrees with it." The reason being is that you are wrong. In reading the book I am more interested in the linear progression of activity and events surrounding BC Ferries rather politcs. I'm not really terribly concerned about the semantics of whether these two modest works are primary historical documents or not. Suffice to say that historians would have it pretty easy if such efforts were classed as 'historical narratives'. These are books for people just getting interested in ferries, or for young readers, and the political references- some subtle, some blatant- need to be noted. I think it's naive to say that a history of BC Ferries can be devoid of politics, and certainly not controversy. If you just want to read about the boats and the system itself, fine, but given the complexity of establishing and running our ferry system, it still awaits a chronicler willing to dig deeper and be much more comprehensive than what we've seen so far.
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