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Post by chinook2 on Dec 1, 2011 20:44:04 GMT -8
My take is: Queen of Sidney in Berth 1, Queen of Victoria in Berth 2, Queen of Saanich in Berth 3, Queen of Vancouver in Berth 4 and the black mast gives her away Queen of Nanaimo in Berth 5. I am thinking that pic has to be shot in late march early april 1986, early morning before first sailings, on a day when the Sidney was in Berth 1 on the way from storage to Drydock (she was given a major refit prior to expo at a yard in North Van in spring 1986; very visible as she sat on the ways from the seabus, Sidney was not repainted until that time). The boat in Berth 2 is a Swartz Bay ship, Victoria or Saanich, either heading to or back from refit. Berth 3 and 4 are Vancouver and Esquimalt, and Berth 5 if it is Nanaimo, also in transit to or from refit, or simply laid up while the Tsawwassen was doing off peak service from Long Harbour. The terminal is so empty, can't see that this was shot during the business day.
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Post by chinook2 on Nov 26, 2011 17:58:58 GMT -8
The Queen of New West pics really interest me too, because we have next to no photos of her pre lifting in the late 80s (expo scheme), let alone interior photos! I'm surprised to see the really old dogwood carpet as late as 1989. I thought for sure that the old dogwood carpet was completely removed from the fleet by the late 70's, early 80's. Another surprise, is the lack of the snack bar back then. The basic infrastructure for a snack bar is visable (ie: table seating and partitioning walls..) is all there, except for the actual snack bar itself. I wonder if that was something that had existed at one point before, and then was later removed. While she was lifted, the Snack Bar must have been re-installed. From what I remember, the Queen of Nanaimo was the only one of the 7 stretched sisters with a snack bar. The aft lounge area on the other ships was used as overflow seating for the cafeteria, hence the tables. I just found some photos of the Queen of Burnaby when she was doing business as the Royal Victorian so I'll post those in a couple days. Spending another night going through old threads..... Prior to stretching, all 7 sisters had a "Coffee Shop" window in the back of the aft lounge. Area seating was standard tan like the forward lounges. The railings, tables, and bucket seats were added at stretching, overload seating for the caf, and the coffee shop window removed. Later reisntalled in the Nanaimo as a "snack bar". As a young child, apart from cherry pie in the restaurant, the best refreshment on the Victoria class ships was from the pop machine located on the back wall of the forward lounge, next to the builder plate. Dispensed an 8 oz. paper cup of pop (my choice: orange) for 10 cents. As a group, the Victoria class were so indistiguishable in their original state, if you missed the announcements at the beginning of trip (done live, by the newsstand clerk, who always seemed to have a thick scot accent) the only way to know what you were riding on was to find a life saving ring or builder plate.
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Post by chinook2 on Nov 11, 2011 22:50:58 GMT -8
I have a friend on board. Apparently shes down to a single engine and needed help getting in to the dock. The Vancouver Sun is reporting that SOBC was dead in the water before reaching active pass on the 1pm sailing from SWB. It's not alarmist to say that BCFS dodged a bullet today. A lot of ferries with the misfortune to lose propulsion during bad weather have gone straight to the bottom with few survivors. Lessons urgently need to be learned from this incident. It's interesting to see her ( SoBC) AIS-tracking history showing her slowing down by 10 knots from 17 to 7 in a matter of minutes between Prevost Island and Otter Bay Terminal before not doing more than a few knots all the way to the south entrance of Active Pass before deciding to transit Boundary Pass instead and turn around. According to the statements in that Vancouver Sun story, however, she only was down to three engines, apparently purposely slowing down to seeming dead in the water to see the problem could be rectified before the pass. It was interesting to read in that Vancouver Sun story about a Prius being refused to be pushed ashore due to its weight, though. Unfortunately the story failed to follow-through and explain how that was rectified back at Tsawwassen Terminal. The effects of these winds can still be seen throgh AIS-tracking with tugs such as the Garth Foss and Sea Commander battening-down the hatches at Plumper Sound and Sucia Island respectively, let alone through the weather course that the Sea-Link Pusher is taking while struggling to maintain 6 knots on her way to Nanaimo as I type this, among other examples. 'Tis the season for these delays, but compare anything we might experience as passengers to this example and take stock: The Mauna Loa... SALMON BAY TOWING -- MAUNA LOA by valkyrie3, on Flickr ...Was heading for Port Alice and got all the way to as far north as being abreast with Tofino only to be forced to turn back for shelter apparently all the way south at the Strait of Juan de Fuca; now *that's* what I call a detour / delay. Re the Prius: If the 12V (start up) battery is dead, the car cannot be pushed, as there is no way to put in neutral. However, jump starting it is very easy, if one reads the owner's manual. And, if the hybrid battery is shot, the car will start, and the engine will keep running, albeit with a lot of warning lights flashing on the dash. Something the deck crews could and should be equipped to deal with. a Booster pack from canadian tire, and the knowledge of where to hook it up to.
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Post by chinook2 on Nov 11, 2011 10:37:00 GMT -8
Regarding the photo I posted above... Chris (Ferryman) has asked if the Saanich was just possibly in berth 4? It may have been but it is hard to say for sure from this photo. I do know that these are 'for sure' the Esquimalt & Saanich because we know by this time the Victoria was gone, and these are not ‘B’s. That leaves the possibility of one of these being the Vancouver. However, I have a photo of the Van taken 90 minutes later at Tsawwassen. She was subbing for the New West on Route 30 at that time. Historically Swartz Bay had 4 berths (not including the CP/Seaspan berth adjacent to the BCF facilities). The current berth 2 was added (late 70’s or early 80’s ?) between berth 1 and what is now called berth 3. Of course berth 3 was once berth 2, and berths 4 and 5 were once berth 3 & 4. I have seen many photos of the Queen of Sidney berthed at what is now berth 4. So, if the Sidney could fit in there than so should the V class and the Spirit of Fulford Harbour. It would be interesting to determine the actual year when the current berth 2 came into existence. I wonder if anyone here on the forum has information on this? I suspect that it was added in the early 1980's as the second double decked berth at Swartz Bay to accommodate the four lifted V class vessels. Wett Coast sent me the high resolution image of the one above. (Thanks by the way!) I've examined it, and I'm 99.9% certain it's indeed the Saanich that is sitting in Berth 4. The Skeena fits in Berth 4 without much hassle (she has the same beam of a V-Class), although it is pretty tight. At least she has the benefit of 4 RAD's though. Just for proof that a V-Class could fit in Berth 4, here's a different angle from 1999. This looks like the Queen of Esquimalt is sitting there. www.globalairphotos.com/large/BC/North_Saanich/All/1999/001/2Just for fun, here's probably one of my favourite photos of Swartz Bay of the good old days (for me at least)...actually there's a much better image of this one that is closer, but they don't seem to have it on here anymore. www.globalairphotos.com/large/BC/Sidney/All/1997/001/2Berth 2 was built in 1976 specifically for the Queen of Alberni. Berth 3 (the old berth 2) was the primary berth for rte.1 from 1960 to the early 1980s. Berth 4 (formerly 3) was used for Queen of Sidney in summer from 1965-75 and when needed as a layup slip--Queen of Surrey/the North was stored there for a time in the late 1970s. Do not recall if 1 2 and 3 were all double decked in the early 1980s, but berth 3 was used by the Vs till about 1985, when a fire destroyed a portion of its overhead tunnel. Berth 2 became the primary berth until the terminal rebuild in the early 90s, when berth 1 became primary dock for route 1. Berth 3 was used for supplementary summer ships- the New West and Burnaby in the late 80s and early 90s, C Class in 1992.
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Post by chinook2 on Nov 9, 2011 22:47:45 GMT -8
All the Victoria class ships had a photo display of the stretching process in the 1970s and these were the photos. The poster first appeared around 1970, so the ship being modified must be the Esquimalt or Victoria.
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Post by chinook2 on Nov 9, 2011 8:49:48 GMT -8
I know that ferries to the mainland used Sturdies and those to Swartz Bay used Montague. Sturdies Bay, being more open, was perhaps seen as more difficult to get in and out of in rough weather for the smaller open car deck ferries running to and from Swartz. But my #1 suggestion as to why was to minimize traffic through Active Pass. Other thoughts: - Montague Harbour predates BC Ferries. Before there were direct connections to Tsawwassen there were only ferries to Swartz Bay. For ferries serving the Gulf islands out of Swartz Bay Montague Harbour would seem a more logical choice then Sturdies.
- I assume the closing of the Montague Terminal was done to save money. However, today all ferries serving Galiano have to transit Active Pass. The extra costs in doing so must be less then the costs of running two terminals.
- Salt Spring Is has three terminals. While Vesuvius terminal makes sense for the route to Crofton you have to wonder if they really need both Long Harbour and Fulford. For the same reason that they closed Montague would it not be less costly to run the Queen of Nanaimo out of Fulford, in spite of the somewhat longer distance involved?
According to a 1981 BCF publication titled "Ships And Terminals Information", which is available in the reference section of the Nanaimo Harbourfront library, which details capacity of various terminals at that time, Montague Harbour could accommodate up to PR class vessels, Sidney class only at high tide. One assumes the same might have been the case for Queen of the Islands, hence the decision to use Sturdies for route 9. As for closing Montague, it is a similar distance from Village Bay to either terminal, but moving route 5 to Sturdies allowed for a greater range of vessels to operate on the route, vessels which were coming available to use there. That's my guess, anyway:)
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 31, 2011 19:47:18 GMT -8
Oh what a treat it would be to see the Coq unloading in Darryl Bay....
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 26, 2011 22:52:05 GMT -8
Glad this movie finally showed up on Youtube. The Vicky hasn't gotten her due in cyberspace due to her earlier departure from the fleet, and it is great to see her in her prime, without threat of collision.
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 26, 2011 9:00:26 GMT -8
Note the unique loading procedure: opening a closed stern door each time a vehicle ascends to the platform deck. In the pre "V" days Sidney and Victoria class boats almost never had their aft doors closed, even when under way. The ventilation ports in the bow doors would be closed in rough waters.
IMHO this is the best appearance by a BC Ferry in a motion picture, better by a fair bit than QofNW in Bird On A Wire.
The movie is shot and set in: Seattle, Victoria, and Salt Lake City, in that order.
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 25, 2011 18:25:03 GMT -8
Lovely footage shot on board Queen of Victoria while in service, from the 1973 feature "Harry In Your Pocket".
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 19, 2011 18:43:49 GMT -8
The original staterooms on the B's and the QofNW?? The Sidneys and Victorias all had them, and they were promoted to the public back in the WAC days--rentable for $5. Remember in the early 90s, when my son was young, the Vs had one converted to a breastfeeding room.
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 19, 2011 18:31:07 GMT -8
How un(der) ultilized catering facilities? Snack bar on the Bowen comes to mind.
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 13, 2011 12:40:41 GMT -8
Many of the images posted or linked to in old posts are no longer available. All members should make the effort to keep the graphics cited in this forum accessible.
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 13, 2011 12:28:30 GMT -8
As this is the historical board, I would suggest many of the ships in the midsize subboard should in fact be classed as major ships, since they were built and/or acquired to serve either route 1 or 2. The Sidney class, Langdale and Sechelt Queens, and QoTN for instance. Also, Princess of Vancouver thread(s) should be linked to, since she was at least briefly a part of the BCF fleet.
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 3, 2011 13:23:43 GMT -8
When i noticed the difference between a Victoria and a sidney class.
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Post by chinook2 on Oct 3, 2011 12:40:34 GMT -8
For all her shortcomings, QofTI is a signifigant part of our marine heritage. She was a new build for a new route, and were it not for the SuzyQ joining the fleet would have held her place as primary ship on route 9 for several more years. I am very happy to see her enjoying a third life.
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Post by chinook2 on Aug 31, 2011 16:58:59 GMT -8
By modernizing the elevator system, this means: making it go up and down??
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Post by chinook2 on Aug 28, 2011 22:59:26 GMT -8
Was the test kitchen building the first foot passenger terminal building? I seem to recall seeing a photo or two of Tsawwassen Terminal in its original form with that building being the only significant structure, even before what is now the maintenance building. going through a few old threads....the test kitchen was never open to passengers, afaik it was stores building. Prior to the original overhead passenger ramps being added circa 1970, there was only a covered, not enclosed walkway from the ticket booth, and foot passengers boarded on the car deck.
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Post by chinook2 on Aug 27, 2011 18:07:44 GMT -8
That is the Langdale Queen and and an unstretched Victoria Class Vessel. The B class was not built. Just happened. Langdale Queen at berth 1 and an unstretched B-Class vessel leaving Horseshoe Bay terminal [/quote]
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Post by chinook2 on Jan 5, 2011 13:53:32 GMT -8
Wonder what the cost of adjusting the docks for the Klista actually is?? The wingwalls on the slips are supposed to be adjustable --crew member told me back in '01 they were built to take a PR class ship for emergency purposes, and the wingwalls were set quite wide in their first year of operation after rebuilding. The angle was subsequently narrowed to make a better fit with the Mill Bay
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Post by chinook2 on Aug 31, 2009 23:10:53 GMT -8
Have been offline for a while, but not idle. Took possesion of some family home movies this summer, and includes an entire reel of a trip on the Queen of Sidney in 1965!! shows docking, and mainly out the window shots. will be posting to youtube soon as i get the reels transferred
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Post by chinook2 on Feb 13, 2009 5:02:06 GMT -8
Totally makes sense, and so sad. We could have the Queen of Vancouver II to move the piece to, instead we have the Coastal Billboards. It doesn't cost hardly anything to honor heritage in this case , and the abandonment of same in favor of marketing inspired generic image is pretty much guaranteed to do nothing for the BCFS bottom line.
And, I would like to know where the original portrait of the Queen from the Van is--it is very unique, and had been with the vessel from launch till the order to remove royal images was issued.
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Post by chinook2 on Feb 13, 2009 4:45:17 GMT -8
IIRC, correct me anybody--route 1A was the official designation for the scheduled TSA-SGI-SB service provided by the Tsawwassen then the Victoria in summer 1995. The same number may have been given to the scheduled supplemental service done by the Sidney in late 60s early 70s, or that may have been under the route 1 umbrella. When the Burnaby and New Westminster were both supplementing route 1 in the late 1980s there may have been MDS stops at Village Sturdies or Otter Bay, but nothing scheduled.
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Post by chinook2 on Feb 4, 2009 21:35:47 GMT -8
It was basically every odd hour sailing in the off season. The boats did run with an 10 or 11PM sailing sometimes, but it was stopped as a cost saving measure. One time we missed the sailing by three cars and thought that we were waiting for two hours, when the Alberni pulled into dock. Alberni was not on the ferry schedule, it just went back and forth with a load of vehicles, at that time. The Alberni was affectionately known as "The Truck Ferry" and was originally designed to take big trucks and over heights. Once they loaded on the vehicles, they loaded on the cars that were waiting. You're recollections are correct for the latter half of the 1970s. Up until 1976, however, a four vessel schedule was maintained on both routes, with the Sidney as main relief vessel--in the years when vessels were out longer for stretching the Sechelt would do one or two replacements on route 2. The sailing curtailments began in the wake of the first increase in ferry fares, by Bill Bennett's Social Credit government, in 1977. They doubled fares which had remained unchanged since 1960, and this caused a major drop in ridership. I will try and remember to dig up some news articles on this. In the meantime, this thread is about the QVan, so enough off topic... In the past, as is now, I think that most repairs and modifications were done in the off season, as to not inconvenience the traveling public. Although,some ferries would be in the dry dock during the summer. Year end for the Government was always March 31. April 1 would always be a new budget, thus new projects to be started. I remember when BC Ferry Workers were on strike, they would sometimes picket the dry dock, if there was a BC Ferry in the dry dock.
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Post by chinook2 on Feb 4, 2009 16:11:50 GMT -8
Correct me anyone, but I don't recall service being reduced to 2 or 3 ships at any time prior to the V-class conversions in the early 1980s. Route 2 went down to 2 ship operation following the introduction of the Cow and Coq (after the doubling of fares in 1977) in slack times, but Route 1 needed the capacity of four "Victoria" or "Stretch" class boats plus the Alberni to handle traffic. My old schedules show that two or three boat operation on routes one and two in the off-season, particularly mid week, has been common throughout BC Ferries' history. Some years more than others. Have you got any for 1963-77 that show this?? My recall is that both routes ran 4 boats year round until around that time.
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