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Post by SS Shasta on Apr 9, 2009 9:32:15 GMT -8
I have to laugh a bit at these SOLAS requirements. They are likely good faith safety requirements. Could we conclude that MV Elwha is less seaworthy(subject to more frequent breakdowns) than her sisters?
Here in Alaska we have two AMHS mainliners that are not SOLAS qualified. They are often assigned to the most weather exposed and risky route (Bellingham). These are the MV Columbia and MV Malaspina. They are not permitted to land, however, at the BC port of Prince Rupert.
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Post by whidbeyislandguy on Apr 9, 2009 10:00:14 GMT -8
How/why is the MV Elwha so different from her sisters? Are these changes related to her service on the international route? Sir, where have you been? The changes were made in 1990-91, and were indeed related to the international route--in fact they were specific to it. The Elwha's emergency generator is in a different location (before they realized the stability problems it would cause by putting it between the stacks), she carries extra liferafting, a duty-free store, and the stairs are enclosable structures (the last mod being added in 1999). She's scheduled to be first out, around 2021. (The Hyak is scheduled to be last in 2027 at last look.) Rebuilding her would be thoroughly impractical and a waste of taxpayers' money, not to mention the majority of the reversals would actually cause her certificate to be revoked because the other Supers without the mods are grandfathered in. Current construction, as far as I know, actually has to have the elevator and enclosed stair towers. It's a 'you-can't-go-back' situation. The boat's problems stem from the fact that the design was originally inclusive of these features, and retrofits are always a nightmare for a ship. Oh, and there are vague rumblings that her international days might not yet be over. Don't put too much stock in them, mind; they're pretty vague. I am guessing then this means the Issy's are grandfathered in also for the fact of their stairs are like the Supers. I still prefer the supers but thats me. I have just been on the Issy's too many times when they have problem, that and their shaking kills my back, something EGF and I both noted the other day. By the time the 2020's have come around yes it is sad but yes it will also be the supers time to go. and I fully agree with Barnacle Elwha should be first because of all the thing she has had done and had happen.
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Post by Barnacle on Apr 9, 2009 12:31:32 GMT -8
I have to laugh a bit at these SOLAS requirements. They are likely good faith safety requirements. Could we conclude that MV Elwha is less seaworthy (subject to more frequent breakdowns) than her sisters? You could conclude that, if you like. I can't say I follow your logic, though. At any rate, the safety requirements are agreed to by all signatory nations participating in the SOLAS convention. Admittedly there is a certain amount of 'good faith' in policing them; however, "I've been told" that there are nations that will not accept foreign vessels from non-SOLAS compliant countries in their ports. (I couldn't tell you where I heard that, though, so it's kind of an in-law of truth.) Which is a loophole that I can't explain away.
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Post by Barnacle on Apr 9, 2009 12:32:59 GMT -8
I am guessing then this means the Issy's are grandfathered in also for the fact of their stairs are like the Supers. I still prefer the supers but thats me. I have just been on the Issy's too many times when they have problem, that and their shaking kills my back, something EGF and I both noted the other day. That's correct. The Chelan has had the enclosure mods done to her stairwells.
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Post by SS San Mateo on Sept 19, 2009 22:25:57 GMT -8
WSF seems to be planning on having the Elwha as a backup on the international route. The dockside work scheduled for 10/26 - 12/24 includes upgrades/modifications needed to regain SOLAS certification.
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Post by EGfleet on Sept 20, 2009 3:35:46 GMT -8
WSF seems to be planning on having the Elwha as a backup on the international route. The dockside work scheduled for 10/26 - 12/24 includes upgrades/modifications needed to regain SOLAS certification. The Contract Work consist of the following preservation work on the Super Class ferry M.V. ELWHA: dockside moorage; SOLAS modification to bilge manifolds; interior & exterior deck drain cleaning; deck painting by boat davits; prepare & paint deck in pipe chase; ADA compliance upgrades; renew upper passenger deck tile restrooms entries; renew joiner work in various areas; lower passenger deck/curtain plate steel repairs; remove & replace deck covering; underlayment & steel repair in the lower passenger deck; renew lower passenger cabin lighting fixture lens; renew underlayment/deck coverings in lower & upper passenger restrooms; upper & lower passenger cabin settee cleaning & reupholster; weight control & dead weight survey; and other related maintenance work, as specified in the IFB Technical Specifications. All repairs/renewals on M/V ELWHA have the requirement to maintain SOLAS certification. The Vessel is 382' 2” x 73’ 2”, draft 18' 6” and carries 144 vehicles and 1076 passengers. All work must be performed within Puget Sound, Washington during the period of October 26, - December 24, 2009.The bold bit will involve removing the entire floor in the lower passenger cabin and chiseling out the cement under the floor. The only thing that might delay the SOLAS recert is if they find a whole bunch of rotten steel in the cabin. Given that is exactly what has happened every time they have pulled up the floor/cement in the past....Ugh. I'm wondering if they are full anticipating the potential can of worms they may be opening and if time frame they have planned for it is going to be near enough. Incidentally you can find the layup for fall '09 through June 2010 here: www.wsdot.wa.gov/ferries/business/contracts/UpcomingProjects.aspx
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Post by Kahloke on Apr 2, 2010 16:40:54 GMT -8
Elwha's on the move. She just pulled into Slip 3 at ColmanDock a couple of minutes ago. I'm on Wenatchee right now - we're pulling out. Elwha must be on the way up to Anacortes, or getting ready to head up there.
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Post by Barnacle on Apr 2, 2010 17:40:23 GMT -8
Shaking down/sea-trialing at the very least. The Elwha is scheduld to be back in service sometime this weekend. However, I haven't gotten any notices of an impending swap.* *Which doesn't mean that it won't happen, of course. The other day I was running the Hyak because it was the only boat left when I got there.
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Post by SS San Mateo on Apr 2, 2010 18:26:15 GMT -8
According to the maintenance schedule (last updated 03/23), she replaces the Kaleetan (which goes down to Seattle-Bremerton to replace the Kitsap, which goes over to Vashon to replace the Klahowya) this weekend.
Did the SOLAS upgrades ever get done?
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Post by EGfleet on Apr 3, 2010 4:30:03 GMT -8
According to the maintenance schedule (last updated 03/23), she replaces the Kaleetan (which goes down to Seattle-Bremerton to replace the Kitsap, which goes over to Vashon to replace the Klahowya) this weekend. Did the SOLAS upgrades ever get done? They did get done, but whether or not the state is pursuing the SOLAS cert for her is something else. It was actually done the last time she came out of the yard, but she hadn't been inspected for it yet. She'll be Barnacle's boat and he can fill us in on if she's got a new SOLAS certificate or not. ;D
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Post by Barnacle on Apr 3, 2010 14:23:32 GMT -8
She'll be Barnacle's boat and he can fill us in on if she's got a new SOLAS certificate or not. ;D Assuming that Barnacle has an attention span exceeding that of a flea, or isn't busy up to his ears trying to bring the boat's administrative whatnot back up to speed after a lengthy yard period. ;D
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Rhody
Chief Steward
Posts: 108
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Post by Rhody on May 23, 2010 21:25:44 GMT -8
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Post by Low Light Mike on Oct 30, 2010 21:14:35 GMT -8
Photos of the Elwha as she approaches Sidney terminal. - from my trip on October 26, 2010. ------------- The various angles gives this newbie some clues on what distinguishes the look of a Super-class ship. - all those windows - the sundeck and the observatory open-air rooms at each end of the sundeck (the Issaquah's don't have these). - the car-deck window underneath part of the pickle-forks (the Issaquah's don't have these windows under their pickle-forks). - some forward prop-wash to slow her arrival.
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mrdot
Voyager
Mr. DOT
Posts: 1,252
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Post by mrdot on Oct 30, 2010 22:10:41 GMT -8
mighty fine Washington State Ferry pics sir, mr horn! I just wish our BC ferries had retained their historical livery in the same way, mrdot.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Oct 30, 2010 22:37:07 GMT -8
mighty fine Washington State Ferry pics sir, mr horn! I just wish our BC ferries had retained their historical livery in the same way, mrdot. Thanks Mr. T. I found that the best way to learn about those ships was to ride them. I like the white & green livery.
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Post by Northern Exploration on Oct 31, 2010 6:04:28 GMT -8
Thanks for the photos and travelogue Flug. I have only been on two WSF. Once when I was very young to Anacortes and all I remember is eating a hot dog on the outside deck. The other time was a footie return trip when I was in Seattle at a convention.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Oct 31, 2010 12:54:02 GMT -8
Just for EG Fleet ;D, here's some on-board photos of the Elwha, from my trip on Oct.26, 2010: Here's the 1968 builders plaque. She was built out-of-state, which presumably was the old way of doing things... Here is the upgrade plaque from 1981, and also the inaugural voyage plaque from 1968. ------- Inside, the 2 decks have varied decor and seating: - Midships on the main passenger deck is table-booth seating. And some of the tables have artwork on them: - at each end of the main passenger deck is a seniors-home activity-room style of decor. Good for bingo games, square dancing, etc. (outside at the end is the smoking room / end-observatory - more about that later). - Upstairs in the narrower upper-passenger-deck is the galley, duty-free booth, and some high school cafeteria style seating: --------------- The Super-class ferries have outside/sheltered observatories on 2 levels, at both ends of the ship. A stairway links these 2 levels of observatory, and both are semi-enclosed in style. They are good places for when you want to quickly see out at both sides of the passing scenery. - Upper level end-observatory is easily accessed by the wide sundeck that runs the mid-section of the ship. - On one side of the sundeck is the caged-entrance to the bridge. It was a bit like the zoo.... Once in the end-observatory, you can see the stairs leading down to the lower level. ....and then after you've sauntered down those stairs, you're at the lower level, which is where you access the pickle-forks from. (notice the marine evacuation apparatus stored under the pickle fork and above the gallery-deck ramp).
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Post by lmtengs on Oct 31, 2010 19:09:39 GMT -8
- On one side of the sundeck is the caged-entrance to the bridge. It was a bit like the zoo.... Why all the caging? I thought OUR security was too strong...
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Post by Low Light Mike on Oct 31, 2010 19:32:58 GMT -8
A few more Elwha pictures from Oct.26, 2010: The car deck: - the gallery deck has traffic from Sidney that is destined for Friday Harbor. This traffic is facing the opposite direction from the Anacortes-bound traffic. - the end of the side-tunnel below the gallery-deck. There's space for marine evacuation equipment, as well as a crew lounge. - I'm standing in the middle of the main tunnel, and we can see the ramp up to the gallery deck, and also the end of the bottom side tunnel. - the main car deck. Pretty empty for the portion of the trip between Sidney and Friday Harbor. --------- All hail the mighty Elwha ;D :
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Post by Ferryman on Oct 31, 2010 22:54:53 GMT -8
Interesting to see that WSF uses the DBC Evacuation Slide Systems on their ships. Real simple setup of life rafts for the most part. We use those same systems on our smaller vessels, like the Skeena Queen, Howe Sound Queen, Kuper, Quinsam, etc....the passenger lounges are for the most part on the same deck as the evacuation stations. I just couldn't quite imagine having that on a vessel like the Elwha....and especially seeing that amount of clutter around that one ESS station. Somewhat scary from my point of view, but I suppose theres always that mindset that in an emergency, help should be close by no matter what?
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Post by BreannaF on Oct 31, 2010 23:15:48 GMT -8
Did Mr Horn dare to try some WSF Food in the Galley? lol! I had some stuff on the Elwha: - coffee was ok, and I had a chicken-caesar wrap which also was ok, but not great. I avoided the hot dogs, burgers & smokies that were in the hot-box. Lots of people were having the soup and chilli on the Elwha. The next day on the Walla Walla, we went past the cafeteria, but weren't really hungry for anything, and it was too quick on a 40-minute ferry-trip. You are certainly one brave soul for trying the fare on WSF. ;D You have to remember that most of the WSF trips other than the run in question are actually pretty short runs time-wise, so fast food and cold sandwiches are the bulk of the fare. Thinking back, when I have bothered getting something to eat on the ferry, it is usually the soup. Not much to go wrong there. And it is best eaten outside on one of the ends. looking out over the water. By the way, I have been looking forward to seeing what the knowledgeable BCF rider and fan thinks about our humble WSF fleet. So far, I have not been disappointed. Thank you! Why all the caging? I thought OUR security was too strong... The security system is relatively new on the ferries, and of course have special terrorist-resistant properties that repel terrorists much more effectively than the chain-across-the-stairs that it replaced. It looks impressive, and probably keeps passengers from randomly walking into the wrong place, too.
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Post by Barnacle on Nov 1, 2010 6:40:01 GMT -8
Interesting to see that WSF uses the DBC Evacuation Slide Systems on their ships. Real simple setup of life rafts for the most part. We use those same systems on our smaller vessels, like the Skeena Queen, Howe Sound Queen, Kuper, Quinsam, etc....the passenger lounges are for the most part on the same deck as the evacuation stations. I just couldn't quite imagine having that on a vessel like the Elwha....and especially seeing that amount of clutter around that one ESS station. Somewhat scary from my point of view, but I suppose theres always that mindset that in an emergency, help should be close by no matter what? I think you'll see a shift away from that in any new construction. The Chetzemoka and her sisters have the evac slides at the same level as the passenger cabin; also, you'll note that there are not large, open ports on the cardeck that have long been a part of the design. I don't, however, think you'll be seeing a lot of retrofitting on WSF boats.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Nov 8, 2010 15:16:33 GMT -8
The blocked-off area was where the crew was rectifying your grumbles about the decks... it was blocked off for stripping and waxing. Ok, so that's a similarity between WSF & BC Ferries. We also have esthetician services on our ships, but only on the main route.
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Post by Barnacle on Nov 8, 2010 15:18:59 GMT -8
esthetician services? Never heard of any such thing. The same crew that waves you on and off the boat, cleans the cabins, steers the ship, etc.
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Post by SS Shasta on Nov 8, 2010 15:30:06 GMT -8
Considering the current funding issues, why is WSF running the MV Elwa on the International Route rather than the MV Chelan?
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