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Post by Brandon S on Jul 22, 2018 8:44:41 GMT -8
That's good news, however to settle all disagreements maybe someone can take a photo. Photo taken this morning.
Interesting. I'm not trying to BS anyone here, but I swear that when I saw the vessel there was NO PAINT to be seen on the starboard side of the vessel, unless im going very blind and just could not see it.
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Post by Starsteward on Jul 24, 2018 10:22:54 GMT -8
What we are looking at in this photo is the Port side of the 'NSW".
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Post by yvr on Aug 25, 2018 14:11:26 GMT -8
I attended the AGM on Friday at Canada Place. One of my interests was finding additional information regarding the embarrassing Northern Sea Wolf. The report to the ferry commissioner dated year ending march 31,2018 is a 136 page document and there are just 6 lines in that report relating to the Northern Sea Wolf. I asked the question what is the exact reason the ship is late and why (according to this thread) is it going back into drydock. Mr. Collins stated that he had never heard that it is going back into drydock, in fact during the past week the ship had been powered up. The response as to why it is late reverted to corporate speak of "it's being brought up to ours and Transport Canada's standards". Which tells us nothing. As I was the last speaker the meeting was adjourned, but the topic was obviously now fresh in some peoples minds.
After the meeting was over was the most interesting. I over heard the following conversations. Yes the vessel is an embarrassment. Because this vessel is stripped down to nothing Transport Canada is demanding a lot of standards be met, and obviously B.C.F. had other ideas. B.C. ferries purchased the vessel sight unseen based on a report by Lloyds Greece, it was thought no BCF rep was on scene! BCF is now considering suing Lloyds Greece.
So how much is this little ferry going to run up in cost overruns, and will that number be buried in next years report under some miscellaneous item? Time may tell.
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Post by Starsteward on Aug 25, 2018 20:20:14 GMT -8
I attended the AGM on Friday at Canada Place. One of my interests was finding additional information regarding the embarrassing Northern Sea Wolf. The report to the ferry commissioner dated year ending march 31,2018 is a 136 page document and there are just 6 lines in that report relating to the Northern Sea Wolf. I asked the question what is the exact reason the ship is late and why (according to this thread) is it going back into drydock. Mr. Collins stated that he had never heard that it is going back into drydock, in fact during the past week the ship had been powered up. The response as to why it is late reverted to corporate speak of "it's being brought up to ours and Transport Canada's standards". Which tells us nothing. As I was the last speaker the meeting was adjourned, but the topic was obviously now fresh in some peoples minds. After the meeting was over was the most interesting. I over heard the following conversations. Yes the vessel is an embarrassment. Because this vessel is stripped down to nothing Transport Canada is demanding a lot of standards be met, and obviously B.C.F. had other ideas. B.C. ferries purchased the vessel sight unseen based on a report by Lloyds Greece, it was thought no BCF rep was on scene! BCF is now considering suing Lloyds Greece. So how much is this little ferry going to run up in cost overruns, and will that number be buried in next years report under some miscellaneous item? Time may tell. Well!. isn't that a big surprise! Buy a used Greek ferry sight unseen by a representative from BCFS! Never heard of BCFS pulling that stunt off before! And..Mr. Collins not being aware that the 'NSW" required a further drydocking leads me to wonder what kind of disconnect is rampant at Head Office! Let's have a collective yard sale, bring your serviceable junk and we'll invite the BCFS folks along and see what we can get rid of! Yes, I'd say they'd damn well better sue Lloyd's Greece for malpractice and add on the BCFS legal fees! Not sending a buyer in person obviously shows what a panic they were in to fulfill the re-opening of the 'Liberal'-abandoned route!
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Post by Mike C on Aug 25, 2018 20:56:03 GMT -8
I attended the AGM on Friday at Canada Place. One of my interests was finding additional information regarding the embarrassing Northern Sea Wolf. The report to the ferry commissioner dated year ending march 31,2018 is a 136 page document and there are just 6 lines in that report relating to the Northern Sea Wolf. I asked the question what is the exact reason the ship is late and why (according to this thread) is it going back into drydock. Mr. Collins stated that he had never heard that it is going back into drydock, in fact during the past week the ship had been powered up. The response as to why it is late reverted to corporate speak of "it's being brought up to ours and Transport Canada's standards". Which tells us nothing. As I was the last speaker the meeting was adjourned, but the topic was obviously now fresh in some peoples minds. After the meeting was over was the most interesting. I over heard the following conversations. Yes the vessel is an embarrassment. Because this vessel is stripped down to nothing Transport Canada is demanding a lot of standards be met, and obviously B.C.F. had other ideas. B.C. ferries purchased the vessel sight unseen based on a report by Lloyds Greece, it was thought no BCF rep was on scene! BCF is now considering suing Lloyds Greece. So how much is this little ferry going to run up in cost overruns, and will that number be buried in next years report under some miscellaneous item? Time may tell. Well!. isn't that a big surprise! Buy a used Greek ferry sight unseen by a representative from BCFS! Never heard of BCFS pulling that stunt off before! And..Mr. Collins not being aware that the 'NSW" required a further drydocking leads me to wonder what kind of disconnect is rampant at Head Office! Let's have a collective yard sale, bring your serviceable junk and we'll invite the BCFS folks along and see what we can get rid of! Yes, I'd say they'd damn well better sue Lloyd's Greece for malpractice and add on the BCFS legal fees! Not sending a buyer in person obviously shows what a panic they were in to fulfill the re-opening of the 'Liberal'-abandoned route! I think it’s important to keep in mind that this is based on a conversation that was overheard and is not verifiable at this point in time. As such, avoid treating this as “fact” until we get verifiable evidence that BCF is pursuing such action.
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Post by Brandon S on Aug 26, 2018 14:37:05 GMT -8
I attended the AGM on Friday at Canada Place. One of my interests was finding additional information regarding the embarrassing Northern Sea Wolf. The report to the ferry commissioner dated year ending march 31,2018 is a 136 page document and there are just 6 lines in that report relating to the Northern Sea Wolf. I asked the question what is the exact reason the ship is late and why (according to this thread) is it going back into drydock. Mr. Collins stated that he had never heard that it is going back into drydock, in fact during the past week the ship had been powered up. The response as to why it is late reverted to corporate speak of "it's being brought up to ours and Transport Canada's standards". Which tells us nothing. As I was the last speaker the meeting was adjourned, but the topic was obviously now fresh in some peoples minds. After the meeting was over was the most interesting. I over heard the following conversations. Yes the vessel is an embarrassment. Because this vessel is stripped down to nothing Transport Canada is demanding a lot of standards be met, and obviously B.C.F. had other ideas. B.C. ferries purchased the vessel sight unseen based on a report by Lloyds Greece, it was thought no BCF rep was on scene! BCF is now considering suing Lloyds Greece. So how much is this little ferry going to run up in cost overruns, and will that number be buried in next years report under some miscellaneous item? Time may tell. Well!. isn't that a big surprise! Buy a used Greek ferry sight unseen by a representative from BCFS! Never heard of BCFS pulling that stunt off before! And..Mr. Collins not being aware that the 'NSW" required a further drydocking leads me to wonder what kind of disconnect is rampant at Head Office! Let's have a collective yard sale, bring your serviceable junk and we'll invite the BCFS folks along and see what we can get rid of! Yes, I'd say they'd damn well better sue Lloyd's Greece for malpractice and add on the BCFS legal fees! Not sending a buyer in person obviously shows what a panic they were in to fulfill the re-opening of the 'Liberal'-abandoned route! I'd gladly attend that yard sale!
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Post by Starsteward on Aug 27, 2018 13:10:43 GMT -8
Well!. isn't that a big surprise! Buy a used Greek ferry sight unseen by a representative from BCFS! Never heard of BCFS pulling that stunt off before! And..Mr. Collins not being aware that the 'NSW" required a further drydocking leads me to wonder what kind of disconnect is rampant at Head Office! Let's have a collective yard sale, bring your serviceable junk and we'll invite the BCFS folks along and see what we can get rid of! Yes, I'd say they'd damn well better sue Lloyd's Greece for malpractice and add on the BCFS legal fees! Not sending a buyer in person obviously shows what a panic they were in to fulfill the re-opening of the 'Liberal'-abandoned route! I think it’s important to keep in mind that this is based on a conversation that was overheard and is not verifiable at this point in time. As such, avoid treating this as “fact” until we get verifiable evidence that BCF is pursuing such action. I am well aware of the dangers of 'jumping to conclusions' and treating as 'fact', subjects of "information" that in a court of law would be labelled as "hearsay evidence". That said, my post was reflective of a collective 'opinion', reactionary, yes, but not to be construed as a directive to BCFS and/or any legal counsel they may in retain in the future. To the point of 'fact(s)', I am able to report that the discussion allegedly 'overheard' was not 'overheard' and at this point I will leave it to my learned members of this forum to join the dots on that statement. To date, BCFS has reported that the 'NSW' has undergone a major strip-down, and replacing/repairing/upgrading many major components within the vessel. When various stages of these projects are completed, I would assume that inspectors from Transport Canada would attend, inspect work completed, render a 'pass' or otherwise as to T.C. requirements. Similarly when one is renovating a dwelling property, the more invasive the project becomes the likelihood of inspectors finding additional items requiring changes/upgrades in order to meet current standards increases exponentially. Could this situation be where BCFS finds itself with their 'NSW' project? Is this the reason that a further dry-docking is required? Major work has been completed however I believe T.C. has uncovered something, perhaps deep in the bowels of this aging vessel that they, (T.C.) are unwilling to 'green-light' and are requiring BCFS spend more dollars mitigating the 'problem(s)'. If there are any external sources out there that feel compelled to shed light on the current plight of the 'NSW', please enlighten this forum either directly or by private message.
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Post by Mike C on Aug 27, 2018 16:05:37 GMT -8
I think it’s important to keep in mind that this is based on a conversation that was overheard and is not verifiable at this point in time. As such, avoid treating this as “fact” until we get verifiable evidence that BCF is pursuing such action. I am well aware of the dangers of 'jumping to conclusions' and treating as 'fact', subjects of "information" that in a court of law would be labelled as "hearsay evidence". That said, my post was reflective of a collective 'opinion', reactionary, yes, but not to be construed as a directive to BCFS and/or any legal counsel they may in retain in the future. To the point of 'fact(s)', I am able to report that the discussion allegedly 'overheard' was not 'overheard' and at this point I will leave it to my learned members of this forum to join the dots on that statement. I'm not entirely sure what you mean in this paragraph(s). I don't think that your post was reflective of a collective opinion for a couple reasons: 1) members of this forum typically don't like to be spoken for as a "collective" with a consolidated opinion; and 2) it treated the quoted post and report as a series of factual statements that happened. Your post then goes on to say that the statement was not, in fact, "overheard" and therefore leaving it to the rest of us to "join the dots". This is a vague statement and it's unclear to me what you are alluding to. Surely, we are all well aware of the dangers of speculative posting. We have to work together to ensure that the content posted here is either factual and true, or shown as an implied opinion. The reporting of the Northern Sea Wolf from the AGM was peppered with both, but largely contextualized around unverifiable speculation.
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Post by Starsteward on Aug 27, 2018 19:19:00 GMT -8
I am well aware of the dangers of 'jumping to conclusions' and treating as 'fact', subjects of "information" that in a court of law would be labelled as "hearsay evidence". That said, my post was reflective of a collective 'opinion', reactionary, yes, but not to be construed as a directive to BCFS and/or any legal counsel they may in retain in the future. To the point of 'fact(s)', I am able to report that the discussion allegedly 'overheard' was not 'overheard' and at this point I will leave it to my learned members of this forum to join the dots on that statement. I'm not entirely sure what you mean in this paragraph(s). I don't think that your post was reflective of a collective opinion for a couple reasons: 1) members of this forum typically don't like to be spoken for as a "collective" with a consolidated opinion; and 2) it treated the quoted post and report as a series of factual statements that happened. Your post then goes on to say that the statement was not, in fact, "overheard" and therefore leaving it to the rest of us to "join the dots". This is a vague statement and it's unclear to me what you are alluding to. Surely, we are all well aware of the dangers of speculative posting. We have to work together to ensure that the content posted here is either factual and true, or shown as an implied opinion. The reporting of the Northern Sea Wolf from the AGM was peppered with both, but largely contextualized around unverifiable speculation. Thanks for your reply 'Mike C'. Firstly, I wasn't speaking for the forum members when I used the term 'collective opinion', I was putting a circle around what I had speculated. In fact, I point out that evidence provided in my post was 'hearsay' if what I had opined upon were to be presented as evidence in a court of law. I have never nor will never attempt to speak on behalf of our learned forum members who in many areas possess areas of knowledge I am without. Lastly, please re-read the last sentence of my post. If discussion is not 'overheard' then dialogue has other means of reaching one.
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Post by Kahn_C on Sept 7, 2018 19:41:36 GMT -8
The NSW had its AIS turned back on today for a little while and is flagged as Canadian now... Next thing you know it might even move.
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Post by hwy19man on Sept 8, 2018 3:39:21 GMT -8
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Post by princessofvanfan on Sept 10, 2018 21:46:37 GMT -8
This thing's a scow - almost as bad as the 'wack and NIP.
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Post by Starsteward on Sept 11, 2018 9:10:07 GMT -8
This thing's a scow - almost as bad as the 'wack and NIP. There's a bit of 'research' being done by interested individuals in an effort to explain some of the murky explanations the public has been given for the delay and cost overrun(s) in readying the 'NSW' for service Not including the cost of drydocking the 'NSW' in Greece before the vessel made its' voyage to home waters, BCFS has, at a bare minimum spent $32.6 Million on this vessel and apparently more needs to be spent during another drydocking to take place in late September. I have my suspicions as to why BCFS is being so coy about the cost(s) and timeline for this project but will wait and see what the 'laundry' looks like when the entire 'rinse-wash-dry' cycles have run their course.
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Post by compdude787 on Sept 12, 2018 12:37:30 GMT -8
I'm amazed that this was the best vessel they could find that was for sale. At least it doesn't look as ugly as BC Ferries' other Greek ferry.
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Sept 12, 2018 15:51:50 GMT -8
I hope this project doesn’t become boondoggle while BC Ferries spends as much doing a mid-life upgrade to Northern Sea Wolf compared to building a band new vessel. I can wish that BC Ferries would actually build two more Northern Vessels, one could be a same size and design as Northern Expedition which service both routes 10 and 11 and one that is can hold 60 cars that could be shorten design of Northern Expedition for Discovery Coasst route.
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Post by Kahloke on Sept 12, 2018 16:31:49 GMT -8
I hope this project doesn’t become boondoggle while BC Ferries spends as much doing a mid-life upgrade to Northern Sea Wolf compared to building a band new vessel. I can wish that BC Ferries would actually build two more Northern Vessels, one could be a same size and design as Northern Expedition which service both routes 10 and 11 and one that is can hold 60 cars that could be shorten design of Northern Expedition for Discovery Coasst route. There's a design already out there that would have made a great mid coast vessel. We've discussed it in this thread, and in the Newfoundland Ferries thread, because the design I am talking about is the one used for MV Veteran and MV Legionnaire, the two Newfoundland ferries built by Damen, the same company building BCF's Island Class ferries. Veteran and Legionnaire carry around 60 cars, and at first glance, the design seems like it would be a good fit for the Bella Coola route. Alas, not the direction BC Ferries went...pity. See this thread for more: ferriesbc.proboards.com/thread/3642/newfoundland-ferries?page=2&scrollTo=191899And, a link to Damen: www.damen.com/en/news/2015/10/damen_ropax_ferry_mv_veteran_for_canadian_lifeline_vessel_replacement
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Post by Blue Bus Fan on Sept 12, 2018 19:36:45 GMT -8
I hope this project doesn’t become boondoggle while BC Ferries spends as much doing a mid-life upgrade to Northern Sea Wolf compared to building a band new vessel. I can wish that BC Ferries would actually build two more Northern Vessels, one could be a same size and design as Northern Expedition which service both routes 10 and 11 and one that is can hold 60 cars that could be shorten design of Northern Expedition for Discovery Coasst route. There's a design already out there that would have made a great mid coast vessel. We've discussed it in this thread, and in the Newfoundland Ferries thread, because the design I am talking about is the one used for MV Veteran and MV Legionnaire, the two Newfoundland ferries built by Damen, the same company building BCF's Island Class ferries. Veteran and Legionnaire carry around 60 cars, and at first glance, the design seems like it would be a good fit for the Bella Coola route. Alas, not the direction BC Ferries went...pity. See this thread for more: ferriesbc.proboards.com/thread/3642/newfoundland-ferries?page=2&scrollTo=191899And, a link to Damen: www.damen.com/en/news/2015/10/damen_ropax_ferry_mv_veteran_for_canadian_lifeline_vessel_replacementI think that design would be not effective for the Discovery Coast route because in Newfoundland and Labrador a passenger would be at most on vessel for 75 minutes which those seem intended for. Why I say BC Ferries should modify the Northern Expedition design to make smaller or come up with new design that is better suited for passenger and crew needs on the Discovery Coast route because it can be 10 hours or more per sailing to get final destination.
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Post by blackshadow on Sept 21, 2018 20:22:19 GMT -8
There are face book postings confirming the NSW is now at Deas Dock in berth 4.
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Post by Starsteward on Sept 22, 2018 16:02:23 GMT -8
There are face book postings confirming the NSW is now at Deas Dock in berth 4. Obviously it costs less to keep the 'NSW' at Deas rather than pay for dock space at the shipyard in Victoria. If the 'Burnaby' is still at Deas, maybe BCFS could offer a '2-fer' and cut their losses.
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Post by yvr on Sept 22, 2018 17:27:36 GMT -8
There are face book postings confirming the NSW is now at Deas Dock in berth 4. This piece of Greek junk entered the drydock December 18, 2017. It has now left the shipyard 9 months and a couple of days later. My gosh what a boon doggle, so for over 9 months the shipyard has been racking up the bill. If you think this vessel was completed for the contracted price - think again. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the final bill is not more than 50% more than the contracted price. Guess what people, we could have had a brand new ferry for less, and it would have WINDOWS!
Did BC Ferries do due diligence when they purchased this thing - because it sure doesn't look like it.
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Post by Brandon S on Sept 22, 2018 18:41:17 GMT -8
There are face book postings confirming the NSW is now at Deas Dock in berth 4. This piece of Greek junk entered the drydock December 18, 2017. It has now left the shipyard 9 months and a couple of days later. My gosh what a boon doggle, so for over 9 months the shipyard has been racking up the bill. If you think this vessel was completed for the contracted price - think again. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the final bill is not more than 50% more than the contracted price. Guess what people, we could have had a brand new ferry for less, and it would have WINDOWS!
Did BC Ferries do due diligence when they purchased this thing - because it sure doesn't look like it.
I'm surprised it managed to get to Deas in one piece.... We will all be surprised to see the bill after this is all said and done.
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Post by Mike C on Sept 22, 2018 22:29:54 GMT -8
Did BC Ferries do due diligence when they purchased this thing - because it sure doesn't look like it.
I would bet dollars to donuts that this has prompted a review of BCFS procurement practices and policies. It is a difficult situation for BC Ferries, but also breaks a commitment that the provincial government made to the Central Coast, and has real economic impacts on those communities. It will be interesting to see how everyone moves forward from this; if anything positive comes from this, it will be a good hard look at how BCFS manages asset procurement (and maybe an indefinite moratorium on purchasing ferries from Greece).
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Post by Starsteward on Sept 23, 2018 5:33:17 GMT -8
At this point one can't be sure as to how 'informed' the members of the Horgan administration and Ms. Travena in particular, are aware of the status of the 'NSW' project. I would think that it might be high time for the appropriate official(s) from the Horgan administration to 'invite' the appropriate personnel from BCFS over to the 'Lege' for a wee chat and get out in front of this situation lest the Premier and other government members find themselves defending another 'Ferry Scandal', which could, if timing were perfect, be a wonderful Christmas present for Mr.Wilkinson and his gang!
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Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,272
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Post by Neil on Sept 23, 2018 10:15:25 GMT -8
At this point one can't be sure as to how 'informed' the members of the Horgan administration and Ms. Travena in particular, are aware of the status of the 'NSW' project. I would think that it might be high time for the appropriate official(s) from the Horgan administration to 'invite' the appropriate personnel from BCFS over to the 'Lege' for a wee chat and get out in front of this situation lest the Premier and other government members find themselves defending another 'Ferry Scandal', which could, if timing were perfect, be a wonderful Christmas present for Mr.Wilkinson and his gang! This ferry was purchased when Mr Wilkinson's party was in government, so there is no opportunity for him to make hay. His party was also responsible for cancelling route forty, and then, when the folly of that move was exposed, directing BC Ferries to buy a used vessel. Here's what Mark Collins said at the time of the purchase: “We looked at numerous ships on the global market using both experienced ship brokers and direct contacts. We believe this vessel, with its strong sea-keeping ability, size and enhanced amenities, will provide an excellent experience for customers exploring the spectacular Great Bear Rainforest.”Time will tell. Certainly not an auspicious start.
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Post by WettCoast on Sept 23, 2018 12:30:35 GMT -8
This ferry was purchased when Mr Wilkinson's party was in government, so there is no opportunity for him to make hay. His party was also responsible for cancelling route forty, and then, when the folly of that move was exposed, directing BC Ferries to buy a used vessel. Wilkinson's party was also responsible for giving us this pseudo-private ferry entity, BCFS. One of the benefits we were led to believe was that vessel procurement would be done 'right'. BCFS has not done particularly well with their purchases of used vessels ( Sonia & Mr Spendy 1), and even the new-builds are not arguably any better than new-builds procured in the bad old crown corporation days.
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