|
Post by yvr on Oct 24, 2008 21:42:14 GMT -8
I haven't been by the Deas dock for quite a while, does anyone know if the ex Queen of Esquimalt has departed for the east? If it hasn't, does anyone know why? Also at this time of year how would a ferry of this vintage make it across the Pacific? If it is in the east, lets see if we can get a current photo.
YVR
|
|
|
Post by Ferryman on Oct 24, 2008 21:54:31 GMT -8
The Esquimalt is still here. The last time I had a good look at her was a few weeks ago, at the Queen of Tsawwassen decomissioning. She has been fitted with a wavebreaker at the bow, which is the same one that was used on the Super C's when they were brought over here. There were also people onboard the Esquimalt, who looked as if they were recieving familiarization with the ship, which is probably the reason why she is still here, due to lack of knowledge of how to run her, etc..So the company who owns her now, is likely paying moorage fees, or rent, to BC Ferries for the time being. Also, just for the record....The Queen of Tsawwassen was already de-branded immediately after her decomissioning. So she has the blue funnel, and single blue stripe across the superstructure only. I haven't been past there recently though, to see if there was any new name printed on her yet.
|
|
Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,177
|
Post by Neil on Oct 24, 2008 22:05:00 GMT -8
yvr: At the 'Tsawwassen's decommissioning, a BC Ferries official did indeed confirm that the PJ's owners were paying BC Ferries rent, and that the company that was doing the delivery to Asia was in the process of trying to assemble a crew, which was apparently taking some time because of other commitments.
|
|
|
Post by WettCoast on Oct 24, 2008 22:17:55 GMT -8
I saw both vessels there last Tuesday (Oct 14) and nothing had changed at that time. For more see the Deas thread: ferriesbc.proboards20.com/index.cgi?board=generaltalk&action=display&thread=4246Reply #15 PS: I mentioned on another thread that apparantly the QPR has been sold to interests in China. This comes from several QPR crew members. I was onboard last weekend on my trip home from Victoria. I asked several crew members if this was rumour or fact and was told by a few of them that this is indeed fact. Time will tell. If all goes according to plan her last days of service on our coast will be in late March 2009.
|
|
|
Post by Hardy on Oct 25, 2008 4:44:12 GMT -8
If it hasn't, does anyone know why? Also at this time of year how would a ferry of this vintage make it across the Pacific? I don't think it is so much an issue of the vintage of the ferry rather than the design of it - it is a coastal use ferry after all. They are generally not very good sea-keeping vessels out in the unsheltered waters, being shallow hulled, low powered etc. Their hullforms optimized for in-close protected water work. I too share some concerns about when they are going to try to take her across - it would seem that they have just about lost their window of opportunity for this season, unless they are going to be foolhardy and try a winter crossing ... As has been correctly stated, the delay is in getting a transit crew assembled to take her "home". I would suspect that familiarization with the former Esquimalt is pretty near complete, save for taking her out for a spin in local waters to get familiar with her handling characteristics. The only problem is, if the full crew is not yet assembled for the transit, then what is really the point of doing that? To me, the whole scenario of her sale seems to have been a never-ending muddle. Maybe the ghosts of her departed sisters are holding here, or the will of her existing sisters even ... Maybe the Saanich and Vancouver are lonely?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2008 15:32:58 GMT -8
I thought I would let anyone who wants to know I watch the Princess Jacqueline (Queen of Esquimalt) sail into Port Alberni and dock at about 11:45 PM last night. I heard that there was to be a crew change and she is sailing to the Orient. What day she is leaving I do not know.
When I seen the name I did not recognize it I looked it up on the Internet and found this site and a few others to which I found out the name change and sale of the old Ferries. It's sad to see them go. I remember riding on these old ferries and always enjoyed my trips to the mainland.
|
|
|
Post by Hardy on Oct 27, 2008 16:58:53 GMT -8
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2008 13:22:03 GMT -8
A little update there is a story on the website of one of our local newspapers albernivalleynews.com that explains about the Queen of Esquimalt's stay in Port Alberni.
|
|
|
Post by johnnytindale on Oct 28, 2008 17:56:57 GMT -8
www.canada.com/albernivalleytimes/news/story.html?id=6db0932d-eb2a-4510-98a7-16d84053e3e4Former Queen in Port Now called the Princess Jacqueline, the former B.C. ferry is en route to China Heather Reid Alberni Valley Times Tuesday, October 28, 2008 A familiar form pulled into Port Alberni Port Authority's berth on Monday. A ship dubbed the Princess Jacqueline tied up, but Vancouver Islanders know it better as the M.V. Queen of Esquimalt. Port Authority manager Brad Madelung said the ship is waiting for a window of calm weather to make the voyage across the Pacific to China. Blue Wave Marine Surveyors of Coombs are handling the transfer but employees were too busy to talk on Monday. Madelung said that he thought the ship would continue service as a ferry once it arrives at its destination. That, however, could be awhile. We've now moved into storm season and even though the weather has been very fair that could change any moment. "It could be a number of months," Madelung said. He added that he wasn't sure if the ship would travel under its own power or be towed across the great ocean. The Queen of Esquimalt was built in Victoria in 1963. It's overall length is 130 m and it could carry almost 300 vehicles on its decks. It's a V-class ferry, and sister ship of the Queens of Vancouver, Victoria, and Saanich. Before the Superferries were built, the Queen of Esquimalt operated between Swartz Bay and Tsawwassen. More recently it was a relief vessel for the Horseshoe Bay to Langdale route and sometimes the Horseshoe Bay to Departure Bay route. The Queen of Esquimalt is one of four aging vessels that B.C. Ferries put up for sale at the beginning of this year. The others are the Queen of Tsawwassen, Queen of Saanich, and Queen of Vancouver. The four ships are being replaced by three Super C class ferries that carry 370 vehicles each and one intermediate class vessel that carries 120 vehicles, according to the B.C. Ferries website. Two of the Super C class ships, the Coastal Renaissance and Coastal Inspiration, have been delivered from the shipyard in Germany. The vessels ply the waters between East Coast Vancouver Island and the Lower Mainland. © Alberni Valley Times 2008 This article has a few extra tidbits....NEW! BC ferry ties up at Port Alberni Terminals By Susan Quinn - Alberni Valley News Published: October 27, 2008 4:00 PM Updated: October 27, 2008 4:26 PM A decommissioned B.C. ferry sitting at Port Alberni Terminals has drawn some curious stares from onlookers this week. The ferry Princess Jacqueline, formerly the Queen of Esquimalt, was sold last July and is enroute to its new home in China. The vessel will be berthed in Port Alberni to wait out the winter weather. "This is kind of a different request," said Brad Madelung, manager at Port Alberni Port Authority. "It needs a clear window that probably won't occur until early spring." The Port Authority has in the past allowed larger vessels to tie up at the berth when it is not in use, he said. The ferry will stay tied up for at least the next few months. The Queen of Esquimalt was one of four vessels that BC Ferries put up for sale last January. The Queen of Tsawwassen has already been sold, while the Queen of Saanich and Queen of Vancouver are both still on the block. Built in Victoria in 1963, the Queen of Esquimalt is the sister ship to the Queen of Victoria (which was sold in 2001 to the Dominican Republic). A V-class vessel working the Horseshoe Bay-Departure Bay route, it could carry 286 vehicles and more than 1,000 people. The Queen of Esquimalt was the first of seven vessels to be "stretched", in January 1969. It was cut in half and an 84-foot section was floated into the centre, and welded to the two original halves. Once the weather clears up, the ferry will be transported to the Port of Dalian in Liaoning province. The vessel will be used as a cargo vessel, said Deborah Marshall, director of media relations for BC Ferries. The Chinese owner of the ferry is being charged berthage rate, which is some extra revenue for the ailing port. Saga Industries did not renew its lumber shipping contract with the port at the end of last year, causing "severe cuts" in revenue, Madelung said. Saga did bring in one ship a few weeks ago to take a load of lumber, and "we're still awaiting news for a second Saga call for lumber to Japan and China," he added. He anticipates that call will come before the end of the year. editor@albernivalleynews.com Find this article at: www.bclocalnews.com/vancouver_island_central/albernivalleynews/news/33414029.html
|
|
|
Post by Low Light Mike on Oct 28, 2008 19:15:27 GMT -8
[thread herding]
We have a separate thread to discuss the Princess Jacqueline, and her long voyage away.
We've also see the Alberni news link 3 times now, I think (on these 2 threads).
so I encourage people to continue the Princess Jacqueline discussion on the separate PJ thread. (it's the top of page thread on the "in their wake" page of this forum.
In fact, please don't use this here "4 ships for sale" thread for any more Princess Jacqueline items - she has her own thread.
[/end thread herding experiment]
|
|
|
Post by Curtis on Apr 21, 2009 9:42:34 GMT -8
With the retirement of the QPR, BC Ferries has three surplus vessels to sell. As we know, they've been successful in selling the Esquimalt and Tsawwassen, but the Vancouver and Saanich remain unsold. www.bcferries.com/bcferries/face/attachments?id=97209Is there any room in this world for two "V" Class vessels?! I can think of a few places in the world that might put the QPR to use...
|
|
|
Post by Starsteward on Apr 21, 2009 13:49:45 GMT -8
Would love to hear your ideas there ship-Rider 16. Her hull has had a couple of 'make-overs' and I'm told her basic machinery is in good order. There's about 174,000 hours on her original engines but hey... Now if we could just find a way to get rid of the asbestos that she has in her from top to bottom, I'd love to buy the old girl. What a yacht! Ha Ha:)
|
|
Mill Bay
Voyager
Long Suffering Bosun
Posts: 2,886
|
Post by Mill Bay on Apr 21, 2009 18:15:36 GMT -8
If it weren't for the asbestos issues, I would opt for the same treatment for all three of them... As was suggested by a terminal attendant in Skidegate at one point: strip them down, detox them, clean them out thoroughly and then find selected spots along the coast to return them to the eternal ocean. I know that it would mean most people wouldn't ever get the chance to see them again, but what better way to truly let the ships rest, instead of forcing them into some sort of ill-conceived service somewhere in another country until they fall apart from neglect.
I know it's just a function of human nature, and the capitalist system, but why do we keep expecting that other countries will run ships that we no longer consider safe for ourselves to run on our system. The fact that another country would actually do so is just a sad symptom of a greater disease making the ships more unsafe than rust and failing machinery ever could.
|
|
|
Post by markkarj on Apr 26, 2009 11:46:48 GMT -8
My question is what will BC Ferries do if they can't find any buyers for the ships. Has the market dried up, given the economic decline?
If they can't sell them, what do you think will happen to them? Ship-breakers?
M
|
|
|
Post by Low Light Mike on Apr 26, 2009 16:29:05 GMT -8
My question is what will BC Ferries do if they can't find any buyers for the ships. Has the market dried up, given the economic decline? If they can't sell them, what do you think will happen to them? Ship-breakers? M As has been mentioned in other threads regarding the old ships, the asbestos problem is impacting the domestic sales market for any of the old ferries. Asbestos is so omnipresent in the old ships and the cost to remove is a huge item for whoever owns the ships. I think that this evil deity of " Omnipresent Asbestos" will ensure that all of the remaining ships get sold to overseas users who will deal with the asbestos problem under their own local labour & health standards. It sounds like BC will be exporting carcinogens to other countries.
|
|
|
Post by markkarj on May 3, 2009 7:18:01 GMT -8
|
|
|
Post by Taxman on May 3, 2009 7:37:09 GMT -8
[thread herding] We have a separate thread to discuss the Princess Jacqueline, and her long voyage away. We've also see the Alberni news link 3 times now, I think (on these 2 threads). so I encourage people to continue the Princess Jacqueline discussion on the separate PJ thread. (it's the top of page thread on the "in their wake" page of this forum. In fact, please don't use this here "4 ships for sale" thread for any more Princess Jacqueline items - she has her own thread. [/end thread herding experiment] They just keep ignoring you flug? Build date reveils this to be the PJ, doesn't surprise me based on some rumours I heard from one of my friends who has connections on the Alberni waterfront scene.
|
|
|
Post by bcferryfan87 on May 3, 2009 19:07:37 GMT -8
My question is what will BC Ferries do if they can't find any buyers for the ships. Has the market dried up, given the economic decline? If they can't sell them, what do you think will happen to them? Ship-breakers? M As has been mentioned in other threads regarding the old ships, the asbestos problem is impacting the domestic sales market for any of the old ferries. Asbestos is so omnipresent in the old ships and the cost to remove is a huge item for whoever owns the ships. I think that this evil deity of " Omnipresent Asbestos" will ensure that all of the remaining ships get sold to overseas users who will deal with the asbestos problem under their own local labour & health standards. It sounds like BC will be exporting carcinogens to other countries. I'm puzzled about the asbestos issue. How were these ships still in service (and what about the Nanaimo, Burnaby etc) with Asbestos in them? I thought the Asbestos was removed years ago? I've at least heard hearsay stories that it was. To hear the Van etc had asbestos still on them as of this year - and they had passengers (And crew that were on them daily), concerns me. Is that the standard? That is, are they allowed to operate with Asbestos in them? What does worksafe /Wcb say about that ? Just curious for some insight. As for that link: Is that the Jacqueline (aka Esquimalt)?; man they are asking big bucks vs what I heard the Gov't got. And no I'm not making this a "fast ferry type issue". My point is, I think the seller is dreaming of getting that amount, based on market value, aren't they - 3.5 million dollars?
|
|
|
Post by Low Light Mike on May 3, 2009 20:02:12 GMT -8
I'm puzzled about the asbestos issue. How were these ships still in service (and what about the Nanaimo, Burnaby etc) with Asbestos in them? I thought the Asbestos was removed years ago? Not removed, just enclosed. And the enclosure wasn't working so well on the MV Quadra Queen II.
|
|
|
Post by Variable Pitch on May 3, 2009 20:21:25 GMT -8
First of all, I thought the PJ (aka Q of E) was already sold, unless their buyers are already trying to flip her.. Second, if the link to this UK brokerage is recent, seems to me that this is the Queen of Saanich and not the PJ. Saanich was built in 1963 also, and, as it has been pointed out in many threads, if you look at the upper car deck portholes at the bow, they are all the same width. Esquimalt (PJ) had that unmistakable narrow "window", 3rd from the bow. This does appear to be the case in the picture. Maybe they are using a pic of the Saanich, but from this pic it is clear that it is the Saanich. I just noticed too, if you look at the forward lounge windows, they have the curtains, which were synonymous with the Saanich. To try and sell the PJ using these pictures could be a misrepresentation and grounds for "trouble"....
|
|
|
Post by WettCoast on May 3, 2009 20:32:29 GMT -8
There are also a few other clues that say this is the Saainch and not the Esquimalt.
Example:
Note the date coincides with the Saanich retirement.
|
|
|
Post by Variable Pitch on May 3, 2009 20:36:23 GMT -8
Good point Jim, I missed that. I was going by the photos on the website alone. I'm more of a "visual" guy....
|
|
Neil
Voyager
Posts: 7,177
|
Post by Neil on May 3, 2009 21:02:44 GMT -8
See reply #3, in the 'Quadra Queen' thread, for a previous statement from BC Ferries on the asbestos issue.
|
|
|
Post by PCL Driver on May 4, 2009 7:20:48 GMT -8
The image of the interior is the forward lounge of the Saanich.
|
|
|
Post by WettCoast on May 4, 2009 20:32:12 GMT -8
I'm puzzled about the asbestos issue. How were these ships still in service (and what about the Nanaimo, Burnaby etc) with Asbestos in them? I thought the Asbestos was removed years ago? I've at least heard hearsay stories that it was. To hear the Van etc had asbestos still on them as of this year - and they had passengers (And crew that were on them daily), concerns me. Is that the standard? That is, are they allowed to operate with Asbestos in them? What does worksafe /Wcb say about that ? Just curious for some insight. Carcinogen - an agent or chemical that can cause cancer. Asbestos is a carcinogen? Clearly the answer is yes! Now, excessive sunlight can cause cancer, right? Therefore the sun is a carcinogen? right? End of questions Asbestos is dangerous only when dispersed as fibres in the air. Asbestos bound up in concrete or floor tile etc. does not give off fibre. It is not dangerous until you sand it, drill it, saw it or otherwise disturb it. Such asbestos containing materials (ACM) are said to be non-friable. Other more friable forms of asbestos are treated with encapsulants or sealers so as to prevent/minimize the generation of fibre. I expect that asbestos remaining on BC Ferry vessels is either in non-friable form, or has been treated to make it non-friable. All ferries built before the mid 1970's have (or had), in all likelihood, asbestos on board. It is also probable that the last two C class have some asbestos because its use was not phased out completely until after they were built. During the 1980's each of the older ferries were removed from service for extensive asbestos abatement work. I remember the QPR being done at Tsawwassen Terminal around about 1985. I expect that the removal was only partial. They likely removed the more friable forms and easy to get at stuff. Even today I expect that after its extensive 'ancient life upgrade', some ACM still remains on the QoNWM. The 'acid test' for health risk with the asbestos on board (or in any building, for that matter) is air sampling. There are standards for the level of asbestos fibre in air published by agencies such as WorkSafeBC. I expect that BC Ferries older vessels do not have a problem with excessive levels of fibre in the air. However, with regard to recent news, there may be a real issue with the QQ II's passenger lounge, and BCFS may have some explaining to do.
|
|