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Post by Low Light Mike on Jun 5, 2008 16:40:16 GMT -8
well a note about the PRQ. The Powell River Queen is currently behind schedule and will NOT be ready to go back in schedule for the date posted. So That means the Bowen Queen will stay on the Campbell River Route and something else will fill in on route 9A. Also the Northern Adventure will receive another 6 month refit after the summer, apparently it is an Electrical nightmare and is still causing problems. Neither of these is really a surprise. re the PRQ delay: I think that's consistent with all the other recent refit jobs. Look for more of these delays in the future.....the new reality. re the NorAdv: Ouch! I wonder if BCFS is just holding-on until the NorEx arrives in 2009. Assuming that the NorEx works well, this might finally give BCFS the opportunity to take the NorAd out of service for an extended period of time to finally get things right. That's assuming that QPR could still operate to the Charlotte's for 2009 summer. Really, the NorAd problems are such a big issue simply because there's no other vessel available to take her place, and her routes are "essential". The vessel needs a long-uninterrupted stint in rehab, or maybe a 4-year-layup..... ;D
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Post by kylefossett on Jun 5, 2008 23:12:20 GMT -8
Nickfro, your ideas in theory are a good idea. A couple issues I have with it though are the logistics of moving the Mayne Queen between Tsawwassen and Swartz Bay as needed and running a third boat out of Swartz Bay. BC Ferries is already having issues with not enough crews and now you would have to crew a third boat out of Swartz Bay. If crewing was not an issue then I would supprt your idea 100%.
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Post by coastalrenaissance on Jun 6, 2008 11:59:48 GMT -8
The only thing I can see BC Ferries doing is to have the Queen of Saanich Stop in at Village Bay durring peak hours enroute to Tsawwassen as they have done in the past. When she departs Swartz Bay for her 4pm departure Fill her upperdeck with traffic and load up the PCL Buses then depart with a near empty lower Car deck. At Village Bay she can load up traffic and take them to Tsawwassen. Because this will add time to the sailing her pm sailings should be modified. Ie leaves Tsawwassen at 6:30pm. The vessle will sail back to Swartz Bay continuing her regular sailings. Then the Vancouver could drop off a load at Village Bay on her 8pm trip from Tswn. You would need The Mayne Queen and the Cumberland and Q Nanaimo doing thier regular sailings plus I would suggest putting a smaller vessle Such as the kllitsa to shuttle between Village Bay, Saturna and Otter Bay. The Mayne Queen should skip her Saturna Sailngs to allow for extra capacity on the Otter Bay-Village Bay and Sturdies Bay service. In the 1990's they have used the Queen of Victoria, Esquimalt and even Tsawwassen on a Swartz Bay-SGI-Tsawwassen run. Quite simply put, they do not have anyother vessle other than the BQ and Tsawwassen that can do rt 9a. I do not think the Mayne Queen has washrooms on the car deck, so that puts her out of the equation. Or perhaps they can put the Kahloke and Klitsa up on the Quadra-Campbell River run, but that is no where near the capacity neaded for that run. Or replace the North Island Princess with both the Nimpkish and Tachek and put the NIP on rt 9a. (she used to sail between Sidney and Steveston before comming to BC Ferries and she was a lot smaller then) So I am sure she would be able to do the run. But Now we know why BC Ferries decided to build off shore. Our local Yards simply can't compete with the likes of Flensburg and the Island Sky and Queen of New Westminster refitt are prime examples of that. If the yards can't deliver on time then Its time to go overseas! In the end everyone looses out. Look at todays rt 9 schedual. A 3 sailwait! Completley sold out. Now picture this with a boat down in the summer just because WMG can not deliver the ISland Sky on time, Just PATHETIC! There should be MASSIVE Penalties upon WMG if they can not deliver on time. Perhps they should end up doing the refitts for Free if it takes them a whole year to complete the New West's refitt. They can not take BC Ferries forgranted. Especially when they have now gone overseas on thier newbuilds. WMG is no longer the "Only Kid on the Block" and they must consider this with every delay. As a Consumer if I can not get what I need, WHEN I need it from one store, I simply say "Screw you" and move on to the competition.
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Post by kylefossett on Jun 6, 2008 12:31:37 GMT -8
The main issue with the local shipyards is the lack of employees. The same thing that is hurting EVERY industry in this province. The very reason places like Tim Horton's and McDonald's are paying starting staff close to $10/hr. We are in an employees market right now. It used to be that almost evrey employer had stacks of resumes on their desks, now they have to take the first one that comes in.
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Post by ferrytraveller on Jun 6, 2008 15:03:01 GMT -8
re the Island Skye issue: In the contract BCFS has the right to terminate the project, aka. the vessel if it is too late on delivery or has other issues. Apparently they are close to this happening if it goes on much longer.
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Post by Hardy on Jun 6, 2008 20:57:19 GMT -8
re the Island Skye issue: In the contract BCFS has the right to terminate the project, aka. the vessel if it is too late on delivery or has other issues. Apparently they are close to this happening if it goes on much longer. I highly doubt that they would "terminate" the vessel at this stage. More than likely there are target dates and milestones linked either to financial bonuses or penalties. I imagine that they are "escalating" in nature; IE they become more severe as the timeline and milestones are further and further missed. At least that is how, to the best of my understanding, how the contracts with FSG were worded. From my recollection, even though the "signed" contract for the CR had a delivery date that FSG ultimately beat (because FSG was smart enough to build in appropriate allowances for "unexpected" first-of-class complications), there was a large amount of concern at FSG when the propeller hubs had to be changed out -- they'd verbally told BCFS that they were ahead and delivery would be early, and then had to back down to the written agreement when they had to re-prop the ship. I do not know if there were any of these date/milestone clauses put in the Island Sky contract, but it would have been negligent of BCFS to NOT do so. I could see the penalties for WMG easily exceeding 20% of the value of the contract based on the information that we are currently getting. Labour shortages notwithstanding, when you sign a contract agreement, you are bound by the terms. If BCFS allows WMG to weasel out of this one, then there should be strong cries of collusion and influence peddling; I would expect heads to roll, as the fast-ferry fiasco is not very far from voter's minds, regardless of the marvelous job that FSG has done with the Coastals. As was stated -- if FSG can do it on a larger scale x3 from 10000nm away, what the heck is wrong with WMG? Add their debacle to the fast cat stink and the local shipbuilding industry really comes out looking quite pathetic.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jun 8, 2008 8:16:43 GMT -8
The late return of the Q-Nanaimo has the potential to cause a ripple-effect for Jervis Inlet and Discovery Coast.
Let's say that the Q-Nanaimo finally returns to service sometime Sunday.
- On Monday, Q-Tsawwassen can sail up to Jervis Inlet, and start service there on Tuesday.
- On Monday night, Q-Chilliwack can leave Jervis Inlet, and sail somewhere to provision-up for the Route-40 season.
- Q-Chilliwack takes Tuesday to provision somewhere.
- Q-Chilliwack takes all day Wednesday to sail up to Port Hardy.
- Q-Chilliwack does the first scheduled Route-40 sailing of the season at 9:00am on Thursday June 12th.
I'm thinking that the Chilliwack might miss the first couple Route-40 sailings for this season. But she should be ready for the 2nd week of Route-40........
It is interesting how 1 ship's refit affects a ship & route that's 2 degrees removed. Here's hoping for a speedy transition with this one.
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Koastal Karl
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Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
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Post by Koastal Karl on Jun 8, 2008 9:09:21 GMT -8
Yeah I was thinking that too. It seems that every northern route Inside Passage and Discovery Coast Passage summer service they have at least had to cancel either a week or a day or two of the schedule. Why cant they get ships out on time for once??
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Post by Coastal Canuck on Jun 8, 2008 11:30:55 GMT -8
The late return of the Q-Nanaimo has the potential to cause a ripple-effect for Jervis Inlet and Discovery Coast. - On Monday night, Q-Chilliwack can leave Jervis Inlet, and sail somewhere to provision-up for the Route-40 season. - Q-Chilliwack takes Tuesday to provision somewhere. what does it mean to provision somewhere?
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Post by kylefossett on Jun 8, 2008 11:45:17 GMT -8
Yeah I was thinking that too. It seems that every northern route Inside Passage and Discovery Coast Passage summer service they have at least had to cancel either a week or a day or two of the schedule. Why cant they get ships out on time for once?? there are many reasons beyond the control of bc ferries: -a private contractor may be delayed on when they can start -parts may be delayed in shipment -they might find another issue that has to be taken car of
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Post by Hardy on Jun 8, 2008 12:20:11 GMT -8
what does it mean to provision somewhere? To load up with supplies and consumables - food, magazines, vending machine contents, toilet paper etc.
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Post by Hardy on Jun 8, 2008 12:24:02 GMT -8
there are many reasons beyond the control of bc ferries: -a private contractor may be delayed on when they can start -parts may be delayed in shipment -they might find another issue that has to be taken car of Very valid points. And they may well play into it somehow. However, it is not like BCFS has not been doing refits for a while, and most of these things should be anticipated and the refit contractors held to the schedule. In the case of your first point, it is not like BCFS just "drives" a ferry to the contractor and says, "Here's the keys I need it by Friday". Refit schedules are worked out in advance. Contractors KNOW generally what they are going to be doing, as they have already "looked under the hood". As I well know, shipments of parts can always be made to happen sooner, just at higher costs; if a contractor buggers up and needs to pay a premium rate to get a part airfreighted from say Manchester and it costs them $5000 extra, well, that is on them as they signed the contract. The part that makes the most amount of sense, but it cannot keep happening again and again, is your final one - where they get part way through fixing something and discover hidden problems that will take longer to correct that are of such a severe nature that they cannot be postponed or jury-rigged.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jun 8, 2008 13:07:35 GMT -8
The late return of the Q-Nanaimo has the potential to cause a ripple-effect for Jervis Inlet and Discovery Coast. - On Monday night, Q-Chilliwack can leave Jervis Inlet, and sail somewhere to provision-up for the Route-40 season. - Q-Chilliwack takes Tuesday to provision somewhere. what does it mean to provision somewhere? To stop at a terminal to take on the supplies and stores needed for servicing the next route. I'm sure that there's stuff needed for Route-40 that they don't keep on board: rental towels, rental blankets/pillows, salmon-steaks for the nightly barbecues, crew supplies for the live-aboard-crew, liquor for the Route-40 bar (yes, there is one, but it likely doesn't sell Old Yale's "Sasquatch Stout, which I am sipping right now....). I wonder if they have to go down to Tsawwassen or Deas to get some of that stuff?
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jun 8, 2008 13:22:00 GMT -8
Yeah I was thinking that too. It seems that every northern route Inside Passage and Discovery Coast Passage summer service they have at least had to cancel either a week or a day or two of the schedule. Why cant they get ships out on time for once?? there are many reasons beyond the control of bc ferries: -a private contractor may be delayed on when they can start -parts may be delayed in shipment -they might find another issue that has to be taken car of ....and sometimes this type of delay just means that a secondary ship remains as a primary-ship for a few more days or weeks. Like with C-Class or the minor vessels. But other times, a refit delay really throws a wrench into the schedule, such as impact on Route-40 or the Inside Passage. .......But then again, BC Ferries sometimes surprises us with their solutions to these refit-delay effects. For instance, in June 07, I wouldn't have thought that BCFS would actually have taken the step of running the Tachek on Route-9A. But they did, and I got sunburned as a result (but it was a fun day). So refit-delays make for good forum conversation and interesting vessel placements........but can also cause anxiety.
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Quatchi
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Engineering Officer - CCG
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Post by Quatchi on Jun 8, 2008 13:32:56 GMT -8
They probably wont go somewhere special to get supplies. One my recent Inside Passage trip we arrived at the terminal the night before and slept in the terminal. While we were there they took on supplies.
A full size truck and trailer backed ontothe ship and unloaded overnight. Also a fuel truck did this and a welding crew ent aboard. It is probably much cheaper to do it his way then to take this shiop all the way down the coast back to HSB or something like that.
cheers,
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Post by Nickfro on Jun 9, 2008 8:16:21 GMT -8
So the Nanaimo is still at Deas this morning, which reduces the Chilliwack's time to get ready for the summer on the Mid Coast route. If the Nanaimo gets out of Deas today and back into service tomorrow, then that leaves two days for 'Wack prep'. If this doesn't happen tonight, then surely the first round trip on the Mid Coast will be cancelled.
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Post by ferrytraveller on Jun 9, 2008 9:10:52 GMT -8
It is also rumored that both Spirit vessels will get there life saving systems changed and upgraded to the LSA slide systems, since they are newer and much faster some time in the coming years. I have heard a time frame from 2010-2013 somewhere in there.
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Post by Alberni on Jun 9, 2008 11:04:15 GMT -8
QoNanaimo is showing up on BCF Vessel Positions with her destination set for Long Harbour but she's still at Deas. Maybe they move her over today and have ready for service tomorrow. Vessel Status Destination Last Update Queen of Tsawwassen Under Way Southern Gulf Islands 11:28 AM Queen of Nanaimo In Port Long Harbour (Salt Spring Is.) 11:28 AM orca.bcferries.com:8080/cc/settings/includes/maps/route2.html
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Post by Nickfro on Jun 10, 2008 13:53:21 GMT -8
They're currently making the switcheroo outside Long Harbour! Not it's off to Saltery bay for the Tsawwassen until that 'I' Vessel decides to make an appearance! (Hopefully that takes a while!)
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Post by guest ferryking on Jun 10, 2008 14:47:49 GMT -8
Siitech...has the Tsawwassen steaming north in the strait...for earls cove/salterly bay...i would assume...unless there are provisions to be loaded, in departure bay or something. fk
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2008 15:20:56 GMT -8
I just got home for work, today is the three ship shuffle, Nanaimo to Long Harbour, Tsawwassen to Earl's Cove and will finish the shift, and the Chilliack can prepare for the Mid Coast Summer run. All the stocking up of stores are complete and we have crews, and terminal maintenance running everywhere. Terminal Maintenance has to take the bumpers off of the wing walls in Long Harbour. I'm glad I got to be the Chief Steward on the Tsawwassen's last run on Route 9.
Sorry I have not been on in awhile...SOF keeps me really busy...also glad to have met some of you in person the other day.
Gregg
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2008 16:23:13 GMT -8
im guessing shes going to sit at Tsawwassen for a while?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2008 17:01:00 GMT -8
Shes heading north.
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Post by Low Light Mike on Jun 10, 2008 17:35:08 GMT -8
I'm glad I got to be the Chief Steward on the Tsawwassen's last run on Route 9. Wow, that's a great honour and I assume you'll treasure that memory. A question: Apart from nostalgia and historical-significance, is there anything about the Q-Tsawwassen that is better than the Q-Nanaimo for the Route-9 experience (both as a worker and as a passenger). Just curious, about your thoughts on comparing the 2 ships. Cheers.
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Koastal Karl
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Been on every BC Ferry now!!!!!
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Post by Koastal Karl on Jun 10, 2008 18:50:38 GMT -8
I just got back from SSI as I did a trip over to see the ship swap at Long Harbour. I spent about 2 and a half hours at Long Harbour watching the Tsawwassen come in offload vehicles, load crews cars, then depart for the trip to Saltery Bay where she is headed. She left around 2:30pm and she is near Saltery Bay right now around 7:45pm. I watched the Queen of Nanaimo come in and offload crews vehicles and load provisions then passengers and vehicles. She departed over an hour late around 4:40pm. I wanted to get photos of her from Scott Point but I had to catch the 5:50pm Skeena Queen from Fulford so I got pissed off and left cause she was so late. They finished loading vehicles at like 3:50pm after doing drills but dident leave till 4:40pm. I wonder what they were doing?? Maybe Graham knows seeing I ran into him at Long Harbour and he was on the Nanaimo going back. I took some photos which I will upload later.
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